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Am I the only one who thinks that the morale and fear mechanics for the shooting phase are are so easy as to be insignificant?
Maybe it's just because I didn't grow up in the 40k universe but it seems like watching half your squad get wiped out at range might be an incentive to sit your ass down or turn around. Then again, maybe I've played to many MEQ armies but it seems like 7 in 10 units are fearless and those that aren't have stupid high leadership and numerous methods of handling morale. We used to have negative modifiers for shooting but now since those are gone leadership checks in the shooting phase just seem like a waste of time. I play guard, and while I have to take some measures I'm not worried about a unit breaking after being shot to hell. "Hey sarge, where'd the other six guys go? Oh... no worries, I'll be right here if you need me."
Does anyone agree or am I just an ignorant player of questionable morals and parentage?
Not only would people fall back like scared rabbits there are other reasons given for falling back, to re group for instance. Basically you decide why there falling back and i like to think off my gallant troops making a tactical withdraw (Grey kights, like i ever fall back).
Also it wouldn't be much fun if a unit that got shot up ran away every time you had to check LD. Odds work out ok as well so i see no worrys in it (Im not completely clued up on 5th but don't -1 for 25% loss and -1 below half strength still count? Or last man standing for that matter as well) If you've got any suggestions to improve it then go ahead, or is this just a rant?
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Don't forget though that the Morale Check for 25% casualties now applies to all phases(with the obvious exception of CC, having its own rules).
This means that its possible for a unit to lose a few models from a Dangerous Terrain test, then promptly Fall Back.
Personally, I'm quite happy with most things 5th Edition.
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I do think that Morale in 40k is ignored for the majority of armies, at least until you reach CC.
There are way too many units in 40k that are fearless.
I'm not sure how to solve the issue without going too far out the other side. You don't want morale to take no part, but you don't want half your units falling back after a round of shooting either.
Maybe something like epic, where you could keep enemy units pinned by firing at them (even when not doing damage)
It would be cool if a unit in cover that is shot at must take a ld test to move next turn, and if it takes casualties (or 25% casualties) it must take a pinning test as well. If they are in the open, they take a test or run towards the nearest cover or behind a friendly tank, out of LoS of the enemy unit, etc.
Not even a marine is going to stand in no mans land cooly snapping off shots when there is 20+ guys shooting at him, he will slide behind some terrain and even the odds a bit!
With this kind of system you just add the rule that even fearless creatures must take them, and only mindless creatures can ignore the rules (spore mines, rippers, etc)
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Well I always take the view that an average Wh40K game represents the decisive battle between the respective forces. With both forces using their best troops.
Hence when space marines play Imperial guard (who perhaps represent a rebel governor) you can skip the 20 or thirty battles where 50 marines butcher conscript/civilian militia and cut straight to the Governors personal guard vs the space marine strike force.
Long story short even a humble guardsman is still a well trained disciplined soldier ready to lay down his life for his cause.
Of course arguably if you look at the Wh40K mechanics as squad based, rolling to hit wound etc is simply a mechanism for scattering a squad. A casualty may represent individuals in a squad running for it.
The morale check could be said to represent the commanders/sergeants holding their nerve or ordering a withdrawal.
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I like playing by the rules, and not inventing too many house rules (unless something seriously becomes a problem). House rules tend to throw the game out of balance and skew the favors of probability towards a single player in particular, which just take the fun out of the game.
But, assuming somebody did not like the leadership rules as they stand, it could be reasoned that adding tactical options could be added.
Two thoughts I have regarding Leadership is splitting two elements of LD checks into four elements. Pinning becomes Pinning and Regrouping, Fearless becomes Fearless and Mindless.
Where a unit in certain circumstances might be pinned or forced to flee, they might (given a certain LD check, maybe at a range of LD to 1/2 LD?) instead choose to test for Regrouping. When a unit regroups in this manner they are effectively half pinned (can move but not shoot, can shoot but not move) as the remainder of the turn they collect themselve and attempt to regain the tactical advantage.
While even a fearless unit stands to reason that tactical retreat is beneficial to their cause in circumstances, and as such might still attempt to flee (by failing LD checks by more than +2, where 11 and 12 are always failures) must retreat but automatically regroup. Mindless units, on the other hand, are either stupidly oblivious or so devout to their cause that they care nothing for tactical advantage and will either push on or die trying.
I don't really feel that this is necessary though, as the only two all fearless armies I can think of are Chaos Daemons and Nids, and other armies usually only have a few fearless units at most. Besides, they take extra wounds from losing a combat, which is a lot better than it was before (you can actually kill a wraithlord with guardsmen now)
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Bah, what is this fear you speak of? It always amuses me when MEQ players complain about caualties from shooting. Try running across the board w/ a 6+ save! I believe I speak for all of us horde players (nids, orks, IG). Daemons with your invlunerable save... you can shove it where the warp don't shine... You don't count.
Anyway, we do not fear shooting. Because lives are cheap, and and a 30 ork squad can take over 66% causalties before it even begins to think about falling back. Nids have the Hive Mind, and IG vox casters and more special weapons than you can shake a bolter at.
Although the MEQ player fears shooting, we the horde do not! We do our best to work around it. To negate it. To us, shooting is not a force to be feared, but a challenge we must overcome on the road to victory. Besides if you fear a phase in this game so much, why play the game at all?
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Could it also be due to the slight skew towards close combat in 40k at present.