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Hey guys i have a little problem...
I have some friends that keep ragging on me and telling me that they're not going to play my high elves because they're to overpowered. Are there any arguments in my favor other than the classic "low toughness." Things are looking a little broken even to me.
Now, I've never played against high elves, but from what I've read online they have a low model count. Also, their archers are supposed to be overpriced. What exactly do your friends consider overpowered?
Most likely they think the speed of asuryan (spelling?) where you always strike first is overpowered. Well, it doesn't work against impact hits, and the bonus is basically only gained if they charge you, because if you charge them you get to go first anyway. You will most likely still have a lower model count, despite the fact that they lowered the cost of the spearmen. Your heroes(like all elf heroes), in my opinion, are also more expensive than they should be, but only by 20 points or so(especially casters). The lower armor on core troops and only t3, means that it is easier to make them fall due to shooting. High elves also don't have a dedicated throw away unit, seeing as the cheapest core thing they can regularly field is 90 points if I am not mistaken. I suggest your friends take a couple shooting units and a couple chariots, and if they are vampire counts and don't have either...well...wait until the new armybook comes out.
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Warhammer Fantasy armies do NOT have Codices. They have Army Books.
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Somebody said that GW said it was fair and gave reasons at some GT (UK I think) but I never did see the reasons. The competitors all agreed so the story goes.
That's 3rd or 4000th hand gossip so probably all lies but hey
What happens when HE charge HE?
Thanks for the in put guys.
Because of this criticism from my buddies i have been thinking on some interesting lists....
particularly one comprised of the New shadow warrior character (which reputedly makes shadow warriors a core choice) several groups of shadow warriors some Elyrion Reavers (spelling) a mage with shadow magic and maybe a couple normal (non-lion) chariots. The paint scheme would be black and gray, ya know... a shadow-ish army thing.
My point was chariots still get their impact hits first, and if the high elves charge you they sort of "lose" their bonus to go first because charging gives them that anyway(not saying that getting charged is always the best idea). Striking first in combat doesn't matter if you shoot them from far away, seeing as their armor isn't the best (yay 5+ save). The real problem is going to be swordmasters, with their 2 greatweapon attacks that always go first. Any army without shooting (chaos, beasts, vampire counts) is going to be at a disadvantage. Especially beasts, they have enough problems as it is, and really rely on getting those attacks first on the charge.
The speed does mess with normal army tactics of anvil+hammer. Any savvy HE player will just direct their attacks at the hammer unit, knowing that the anvil will cause no wounds. I am sure after a few months people will devise tactics to get around it.
Tell your friends not to say it os overpowered based on theory and to actually try playing against you a few times and see how it goes before complaining about how overpowered it is. After they have some real experience, then they can complain.
And yeah, I think it was me that said the game designers justified strike first at GD UK. Apparently they convinced everyone they talked to. Its not out here, but I imagine the november WD has a fair bit of stuff on HE and will probably try to justify it.
Personally, I think strike forst should be from the front only, not the flank or rear. That makes it juust a bit too powerful from a theory point of view. And it would make sense, they do an 'opening scene LOTR' attack when the enemy charges the front, which is cool, but are caught offguard from the flank or rear.
But thats my opinion before I've tried it. I'll have a few games against my friends and see how it goes, and if it seems too powerful I'll probably introduce a house rule that strike first only counts from the front. And to compensate they may even let my archers shoot in two ranks, since they think that HE archers are crap.
High Elf cav will still likely be slaughtered if you charge it first, and the heavy hitters of the high elves are still very weak against shooting (and potentially magic if the HE player isn't playing a magic heavy or balanced list). Spearmen become a lot less scary if you flank them..so coordinate charges...
It's really not THAT bad..don't get me wrong..it is really good..but unbeatable? Pullease.
I dont see how beastmen will have problems, they get core chariots. Tell you're friends to stop bieng **** and wait for the army book to be released. ASF isnt going to make much of a difference as the elves strongest point was always manouvarability and high I anyway. The dragon at hero level might be slightly over powered though in teh smaller games.