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I'm quite embarassed to admit this, but I'm in need of help against...oh boy...here goes...Night Goblins! There! I said it! They are soo frustrating! They can field a ridiculous amount of foot troops, counter any charges (with fanatics) and field a large number of (cheap) mages...all in one list.
My main problem is the mages...they cost about half as much as a HE mage and are just as effective at generating power/dispell dice. If I try to counter them with my own mages, I can't get off a good spell and I leave myself vastly outnumberred by extremely low point costing infantry. However, if I try to field enough troops to actually have half a chance of fighting them, I leave the mages free to cause large amounts of damage amongst my troops, and then the fanatics come out and make it imposible for me to charge. Bolt throwers dont work too well either, goblins (apparantly) have a spell that when cast, specifically hits the crew and not the machine...one spell kills my RBT crew! The only time I have had even a slight amount of success was when I fielded a dragon for the Terror tests...only problem with that is that if they pass the initial terror test, then they're never going to take it again...also they're going to have a much better Ld because the player is going to field Grom in 2k point games...which I badly want to play because I really dont enjoy small games...
So anyways! Now that I'm done with my rant...does anyone have any suggestions on how to deal with these mephitic, toadstool gorging runts?
Something sounds fishy about this guy. I have a friend who play OG and I also have a vast OG army (although I still need to get it ready for gaming) and as far as I'm aware they don't have a spell that targets only the crew. All hits are randomized between the crew and the machine. Also- remember that all Goblins (night gobbos or otherwise) fear all Elves. They also have to take animosity.
If he's going to play the typical cheese list of HUGE night gobbo units decked out with Fanatics and a horde of cheap mages, then I'd give him a taste of the same:
Eagles can drop any mages that he might leave outside of a unit. However, better yet would be to take 4RBTs. Just target one unit at a time, with the 6shot option, and force leadership checks.
Take NO ELITE INFANTRY. They're too expensive, and their strength is way too high for killing lowly T3 gobbos. I'd go with Cavalry if you need to take anything Elite. Cavalry might be good for pre-emptive strikes, but those fanatics are going to hurt so uh- it might be best to pass on them as well.
If you want to outmagic him, perhaps take the SMs (best against horde units), or PGs (their wardsave can fend off magic) and give them the Banner of Sorcery.
Also naked Ellyrion Reaver units would be great to flank with. They are comparatively cheap, and with spears their strength bonus is actually signifigant against the T3 gobbos! A unit of 6 of these guys will count as an additional 12unit strength, and will negate ranks bonuses. And, if worst comes to worst, you can always declare the charge with the cavalry first, so that they are the ones who draw out the fanatics, instead of your infantry.
For infantry, go with either archers or LSGs or big units of spears. The archers are quite obvious because you can sit down and shoot their units to pieces. The LSG are expensive, but they can shoot, and their stand-and-shoot option will make them extremely dangerous to the incoming hordes. The Spears are cool, but sadly, they won't be able to shoot (which is where you'll make back most of your points) they can hold a line, their numbers will be the closest to those of the gobbos, but the fanatics will hit them and tear them to bits rather quickly.
For Lords and Heroes I'd take:
1 lvl4 archmage with the Annulian Crystal, Dispel Scroll, and then either the Reaver Bow, or Loremaster's Cloak. This mage will give you either an additional source of not only magic but shooting too, or an effective spell nullifier to put into a unit, or, an untouchable mage.
2lvl 2 mages, maybe a lvl1 give these guys stuff like Sigil of Asuryan, Trickster's Pendent, Gaurdian Pheonix, Seer Staff (on the lvl 1), any of the options listed under the lvl4 and obviously dispell scrolls.
This would give you another mage who grants magic defense to one unit just by his presence. The Sigil is good for knocking out his favorite spell, Trickster's Pendent is great against faulty Gobbo magic, and the Lvl1 with a seerstaff makes him worth it, since he can get the spells he wants.
Be sure to take lore of fire with your mages. Perhpas someone could grab the High Lore to get in on the 'Curse of Arrow Attraction', but fire offers some great spells. Conflagration of Doom is devastating to goblin units, because it hits EVERYONE in the unit. Wall of Fire is equal devastating, for pretty much the same reason. And the potential to get a bunch of magic missiles will mean that you're lobbing potentially lethal spells at him for the entire phase.
When it comes to defense, you've got the Lvl4 who could be giving a unit a 2+ward against magic wounds, another mage who's giving Magic Resistance to any spells affecting him or his unit, and then the availablilty of a banner that will give a third unit Magic Resistance. You're also going to be taking the Annulian Crystal, which will give you an additional dispell dice and take one of their powerdice. This tactic is clearly expensive, but without wasting points on needless elite infantry, you should have an opening to get a few mages onto the table. Preferably you'd have one in each unit, to try and nullify magic before you even need to dispell it.
That will take care of your magic problem hopefully. All you'd have left to do is shoot the bejeezuz out of the incoming enemies and magic them to death wherever possible. When combat is finally joined you'd hopefully have knocked the enemy numbers down enough that you can deal with them.
A Dragonmage might also work or anything riding a dragon, night goblins arent the bravest things ive seen.
I once wittnessed a game where on turn one a Skaven player (using Skitterleap) sent an assassin right between two units with three fanatics each. In this case the goblin player couldn't even choose the direction in which his fanatics left the units. The resulting carnage almost immediately decided the game. 8X
So how about this:
- A level 4 Archmage with the Book of Hoeth and a level 1 Dragon Mage with the Annulian Crystal to deal with his magic and to cause some terror tests,
- 2 Great Eagles to deal with the fanatics and
- 2 units of 10 Archers and 2 Repeater Bolt Throwers to shoot him to pieces
You my 2 cents :C
He can always choose which way the fanatics go, you don't have to release them at the enemy (he could release behind his unit and off the board if he was right up against the board edge.
Goblins only fear elves if they don't outnumber them 2:1. If he is playing all goblins, there's a good chance that he would never have to take a fear test.
I disagree with the Captain. He probably has nets, if he has fanatics - so your T3 actually becomes T4. So Swordmasters/dragon Princes would be useful, just be wary of their shooting which is just as effective if not more, since they get theirs for 5 pts each and the doomdiver is much more devastating. But spearmen are still a good bet. You have to have baiting units like great eagles, or reavers to deal with his fanatics. A simple longbow on your heroes, (if you take them) has a decent chance of picking off lone fanatics too.
Annulian crystal would be good if he does actually have 4 shamen. The good thing is they can't get a lot of power dice and most of their spells are highcost, the bad is that if he has night goblins, they can use mushrooms. I think fear should be a tactic though, so the fire spells (especially the burning head spell) should help him off the board.
Thanks for all the ideas so far, they've been really helpfull.
I'll try to play a game against him on the weekend, and I'll probably sub in a lot of units(like my brothers DE crossbows as HE archers) seeing as I dont have all that many models myself...my group seems to prefer 40k.
I think I'll go for the 2 RBT and 2 Great Eagle combo, it doesnt really matter if he can choose the direction they come out if I force them to come out early enough.
A bunch of mages is easy, I have a bunch of those (well, Teclis and 2 others...ill just use Teclis as a regular Archmage and ill just try to buy a new mage before the game, if not, I could always ujst use a captain...I seriously need to buy some more apropriate models!)
A dragon mage is something to think about right now...the terror tests are good, the extra power die is good, the only problem I see is that he takes up 2 hero slots because of the dragon.
I guess I'll take a bunch of archers too...it's really cheesy but oh well, so is the gobbo list.
I should probably take a unit of PG as well with the Banner of Sorcery, I could also use them as a counter charge unit...or maby not...but the banner is good.
When my eagles force his fanatics out, I imagine that he would be somewhat more cautious in his advance, leaving me more time to shoot him a lot...I might not even want to kill his fanatics at that point...