Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
So Several friends of mine play 40k, but 2 of us decided to turn in our bolters and pick up Spears, we shall see shortly if it was a wise move. We are looking forward to what we perceive as the increased tactical aspects of Fantasy. I just happened to have a fairly sizeable force of HE already, and he is going to go with Lizardmen.
So what I have to build around
20 WL + Command
20 SM + Command
5 Silver helms
1 Tiroc Chariot
1 foot wizard
1 Griffon rider
1 Dragon rider.
We are looking to get some 1500 point games in as we learn the game. Thankfully someone else here is also playing Lizardmen and there is a lot of helpful tips.
I guess some things I am looking at for our games is, How important is it to have something to March block? he will have 2 sauri blocks + EotG and 1 unit of cold ones to deal with, sprinking in a mounted hero and some skinks and you got his army.
my force is of course not as formidable looking:
1 unit Dragon Riders
1 med size PG, 1 small SM, one small Archer, 2 rbt, noble(mage lv1) mage lv 2 with ring of fury, PG hero guy, and the powerdice generating banner.
I would like to try some different things out but I keep envisioning his EotG and sarui blocks just marching right down the middle and throttling my army...
I would like a few suggestions on what I should add to what I have, and if I should to make a more mobile force?
We are proxying some at first to figure out some what we should buy next
Well to answer your first question on the march block it would be a good tactic against the Lizardmen but with skirmishing units of skinks available it makes it hard to get into those positions with either reavers or eagles, because he'll probably deploy them on the flanks and with their shooting they would be a couple of hundred points wasted.
I think taking 2 bolt throwers is nearly a must for any high elf army over 1000 points. Keep firing the D6 bolts into the engine and with some offensive magic you should take it out before it reachers you. Im not sure whether your dragon rider is a hero on dragon or dragon princes of caledor?? If it is a hero i'd suggest the dragon mage, lvl 2 with silver wand and guardian phoenix. Something like that on the battlefield would put similiar thought into your mates head in regards to you with his engine of the gods.
The swordmasters are going to get alot of attention, this will happen no matter who you play, so protect them well. Lizardmen use the lore of heavens and there isnt too much on the offence in that lore compared to some of the others. In saying that the banner of arcane portection can protect your swordmasters. I'd also suggest dropping a noble in here with the sacred insence, giving the unit -1 to hit with shooting. Give him a great weapon and just normal heavy armour. This will make the swordmasters nearly untouchable before combat and thats what you want. With the white lions a mid sized unit of about 15 with command and the lion standard should be able to hold saurus up. If you didnt want to run a second block of elves a lion chariot or 2 is always handy and so are dragon princes or caledor. Both options are good for the charge/counter charge into the flanks.
So I actually got my first games in. I decided I just wanted to try out different things to get a feel for things. We got 2 games in against lizards, and fun was had.
I went with (still dont got all the names)
Noble BSB with battle banner/great weapon
14 Phoenix guard with command and Named PG hero
7 SM with Standard/champ
6 SM with Standard/champ
1 Wizard with ring of fury, extra spell item
So I learned right off that deployment and facing is not utterly important, but also very difficult to recover from. Game one My opponent just came straight for me with no flanking support, I was able to knock out the Cav, and then my more mobile units were able to take the fightto him with flank a and elite charges.
Though through both games I really did not do anything to his EotG. Actually I only did like 2 wounds to it at the end of the first game in 2 games. I already fear that blast it throws out there with no armor save.
I really like the Lion Chariot, as it had enough pop to take the fight directly at small cav units. I want to include some cav, and I think a flying noble would be a nice touch, as I want to keep my army fast.
What is a good way to deal with those pesty chameleon skinks hiding in a forest by my deployment? I did not have any skirmishers of my own or WL's
Well in the end fun was had and we are already planning our next games.
I personally don't like to put standards in your smaller units esp. swordmasters as they can be broken easily and this can cost you an extra 100 victory points.
As for the Chameleons, you could try sending Caradryan in there unassisted, this will give you 360 degrees sight arc and 10" movement. If nothing else it should scare the chameleons out of the forest, his ward plus the -2 to hit for being in a forest by himself. That does seem a bit extreme but it should work.
Agreed, a couple of well aimed fireballs (5+ to cast) or a fiery blast (8+ to cast) from a mage with the lore of fire should take care of them as well, toughness 2 with no armour meaning that both spells will be wounding on 2's.
I'm glad you enjoyed your first game. I've played both fantasy and 40k but fantasy stuck with me where 40k never did. As a relatively new High-Elf player myself, I have a few bits of advice for you, traps that I've fallen into myself:
Caradryan (The Phoenix Guard Captain) does not have to be put in with the phoenix guard. Don't let lizardmen fool you. For the most part, you can put your characters wherever you please. I find Caradryan is actually less effective in the phoenix guard than he is in other units. With his wonderful magic resistance you can use him to protect units without ward saves to protect them from offensive spells. Also, he conveys some of his fear to that unit. A block of spearmen may not look like much, but when spells bounce off of them and units run when they charge they become pretty effective.
Rules wise: Always be open to new rules. Some people miss rules completely when they read the book. 4 months after my first read-through of the rules I'm still being corrected on my rules by the veterans. I'm sure you've had these sort of experiences in 40k. Expect them to keep coming.
The Engine of the Gods is one of the reasons I don't really like fighting Lizardmen. I don't like any stegadons, for that matter. They're hard to kill, do lots of damage, and when used in support roles as well can be the cheesiest part of the Lizardmen. I'm still a bit baffled, but there's a previous thread about what to do about stegadons. If you're expecting your friend to use them a lot, you should look over it.
Good job on your maneuvering in that game. Keep it up and those lizards won't stand a chance!
I hope you keep on playing and I hope you enjoy ever minute of it. Good luck!
So I guess I was a little confused at thisActually if they fail their fear check with only Caradryan being the fear casuer they do not break they will need 6's to hit, as he is the only fear causing US1 he will not out number any unit they charge.
I thought if a Leader conveyed his fear causing to the unit he joined, and then the whole unit caused fear at that point?
Still learning the rules 1 post at a time
Caradryan (in this case) doesnt give out fear to the unit when he joins it. I believe it was a rule change for 7th edition. A hero cannot give its fear/terror ability to a unit but any enemy unit that wishes to charge the unit still needs to take a leadership test for it. But if a hero (without fear/terror) joins a unit that causes fear/terror he will gain that ability while he is apart of that unit.
As a lizardmen player myself here is my two cents. Skinks are really the secret weapon of the army. Fast, cheap, and those blowpipes will reak havok on your lightly armored and low toughness elves. For the most part standard strength three shooting is ineffective against saurus with their high toughness, and armor. To be quiet honest I would use the archers to take out the skinks early and save the bolt thrower for the saurus and stegadon. A friend of mine started playing lizardmen, and for his first battle I used my units as high elf standins. I went archer heavy, and maybe got three bow kills on the saurus while the bolt thrower killed everytime it shot. I completely wiped him off the board, but no thanks to my archers. Now don't take any of this as set in stone because as the wonderful infomercials make clear, "Results may vary."
Another thing that you proabably wont like to hear, but is true. An almost sure fire way to get rid of and EoTG is to charge it and challenge the priest on top. He has no armor except what is afforded by the stegadon, toughness two, and weapon skill two. He is an easy kill. Only problem being dealing with the stegadon afterward, but killing the skink priest not only eliminates the magic part of the army, but means the EoTG can't be activated. My WoC friend loves to challenge my priest with his exalted hero on juggernaut as he has had great sucess with that. I know that high elves don't have the best heroes, but in a pinch it should work.