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Right, there doesnít seem to be a thread like this here so I feel the urge to start one. (Itís a nice big way to make my 100th post too )We know that the High Elves are either the next or one of the next armies to be redone, so the question is, what should GW do to improve the book? I believe that it is being written by Adam Troke (source for that is Harry from WarseerÖI think), and that first draft versions are around already. (Note: I donít know whatís in them. Donít confuse that and think that I do!)
Characters: The ones we have are fine and all, its just that theyíre a bit restricted. Thereís the Caster, and the Fighter. Thatís it. We could use more variety, perhaps a class in between who has limited magic and some fighting skills, rather like Bellnaer (sp?) would be appropriate. I would also like to see an expansion of the Honours system to make characters more personalised. Lion Guard and Swordmaster are fine, but add more like a Shadow Warrior one, that gives the character the scout rule, makes them hate dark elves and so on, or a Caledor one (which Iím entirely stumped about how it would work, but I would like itÖ) This would give a lot more variety in the character choices, I think.
They also need to do something with Intrigue at Court. I realise that it fits the fluff of the HE to have political fighting but it makes no sense that a powerful lord level character would let, say, a Level 1 mage command the army. They should either scrap the rule or make it so that a Lord commands the army, if there is more than one lord, dice off, if there are no lords, dice off between heroes, etc.
Core: I think spears are fine, but could use either heavy armour or a points reduction. Heavy armour simply because this is one of the richest nations in the Warhammer world, and they have a relatively low population which they need to protect. Logically their troops would be equipped very well. It would also enhane the theme within the elven races, WE are the light/no armour skirmishers, DE are the medium armoured raiders and HE are the well armoured army defending their homeland. The problem with that would be that spears would become better protected than the elite infantry (unless the elite infantry received improved armour too). And of course the other armies crying cheese. T3, may I remind you. T3!
Archers. Well, everyone seems to have a rant about these. They are overcosted though. In terms of fluff, they are young elves lending long range support, so perhaps a rule to boost their long range effectiveness could work, or fight in two ranks. Probably a points drop too. I want to see them get something though. Woodies get great archers, DE get RxBs, but HE have nothing special, despite the fact that they are rather goot at archery. One thing I might like to see is a sort of veteran archer unit, one that has seen many battles, and are considered just too good as archers to move into the spearmen. Just a thought.
Silver Helms are fine as they are. Perhaps they will get a slight point increase if anything, to discourage all cav armies.
Lothern Sea Guard need work. They just arenít effective enough. Why would you pay so much more just to give your spears a few S3 shots? I think a reworking of the unit is in order. Who fights with spears on a ship? Its much harder to use on a ship than a smaller weapon like a sword. It would be a good idea to make them a more elite type unit, after all they are a permanent force while spearelves are just a citizen levy.
Special: High Elf special units are generally quite good. Swordmasters are fine, although some people think they need more protection. Iím not sure on this one, as it would probably make them more expensive. But elves are supposed to be few in number. HmmÖ
Dragon Princes, like Silver Helms are fine
Shadow Warriors are generally good, but I think they need to be improved in combat. Theyíre basically the same in a fight as archers, and I think that these grim guerrilla fighters deserve more than that. Perhaps the option of an additional hand weapon?
I canít say I really know all to much about reavers other than that people say that the bow upgrade is overcosted. They should get the bow option much cheaper than they do now.
Finally, Chariots. These seem fine, a good effective unit. It does seem that GW arenít too fond of the 2 for 1 choices anymore, so 2 chariots may take up 2 special choices in future. Also there are rumours of a white lion chariot model. Iím not sure whether this will be a new unit or just a character model. Donít ask me about it, it you want more info head over to Warseer, itís there somewhere. Iím intrigued by this, and if it is a new unit it would be quite interesting, probably slower but harder hitting than a Tiranoc chariot.
Rare: RBTs and eagles are fine. Although eagles may cease to be a 2 for 1 choice if GW decide to go that way. The real problem is the elite infantry. I can see White Lions moving to special and becoming skirmishers. Woodsmen donít march in rank and file! It would also be good as it would make for a bigger distinction with the other elite infantry choices. The stuuborn if with general rule is good, except that we donít know who the general will be. Ditching Intrigue at Court would solve this problem nicely.
Phoenix Guard. They need a lot, thatís for sure. A lot of people advocate moving these to special, but I canít agree there. The guardians of the shrine of Asuryan just need to be rare, they need to! I would like to see these become the most powerful infantry choice, with a cost to match of course. They need stubborn, immune to psychology or unbreakable. Personally I think that unbreakable fits the fluff perfectly and makes them more powerful which I would like to see. PG need to be few in number but killy and very hard to kill off. I think magic protection might be a good change too. They seem the sort of troops that would have magical protection of some kind.
I could have written more than that, but I'm fed up of typing now.
So, what are your thoughts?
there are always going to be units that people just don't like. In fact, there are supposed to be a couple of new units according to the Warseer rumors. As well as a new or revamped hero/character. I am one of the few who actually likes the white lions (even though they seem to whiff on me) I hate the Shadow warriors. But if you mixed the two, like Kislev Kossars (bows w/axes) and kept them skirmishers, they might work. Make them upgrade or more expensive only if you scout them, like the empire Huntsmen. My complaint, is that for the point cost, High elves just can't dish out like a regular old trooper. Most of the time (even with WS4) you are still hitting on 4's, so the WS does not compliment the doubled price for an elf. Especially since so many other core troops are better protected armor wise. I like our magic items, they make up for quite a bit, but I have a feeling they will be dumbed down in the new book - which is unfortunate. I don't think a unit needs magic resistence since the champion can take the Amulet of purifying flame or nearly every unit (elite-wise) can take a magic banner. Most armies have all these magic banners but none of their units can carry them unless they have a bsb. So we do get some perks. We'll see if that continues or if they just whitewash us HE into a more majestic-looking empire army. I kind of hope it comes out this summer but some of me wants GW to wait until Christmas, just so I get a chance to play the old rules a bit longer. I just started playing in October, so I'm still new at this.
I'm not a fantasy player right now but I'm starting and I would love to just see new models for these guys.
If anybody disagrees with me Chuck Norris will roundhouse kick you in the face.....not really. But wouldn't it be cool?
I'd love to see spears 1 or 2 points cheaper, but I think that would make them a bit too good.
I've poached a load of new rumours off Warseer, and I think I'll put them here. As far as I can gather the source is reasonably reliable. Some of the things I'm not too sure about, but others seem to be just what the HE need.Originally Posted by Dosadi
This makes high elf archers even better than wood elf archers. You get twice as many chances to hit so a 15% reduction in to wound (at short range) is acceptable.
The new rule helps a bit against armoured troops, but against unarmoured troops it makes high elf archers absolutely deadly.
I mean it makes taking three blocks of 20 archers without command (other than champs) absolutely devastating: 60 shots/ turn hitting on threes!!!!
About giving a bunch of the infantry 4+ saves... all I can say is *drool* :ninja:
Unfortunately I'm not too sure about the current state of these rumours. From what I can gather someone with a bit of inside knowledge rubbished most of these rumours on Asur.org, however when I got around to reading the thread, he had deleted his comments so I didn't get to see what he had said.
I'm still hoping at least some of them are true, though. Special rules particularly, as lots of special rules make my elves feel, er, special! :yes:
hi when will the high elves be redone????????????
anyone who says swordmasters are okay really hasnt played high elves enough/properly. imo. they are easily, without a question or shadow of doubt the worst special unit, and clocking in after lsg, pg, archers as the most overcosted unit in the army.
as for the rumours:
chariots will probably lose the 2 for 1 slot, but i think eagles and rbt will stay 2 for 1.
whitelions will NOT be skirmishers. 100% sure
price of silverhelms is going up, same goes for dragon princes. DP might move to rare but become a real shock unit.
the price of infantry is going to go down.
2006 Record (2k pts): High Elves: 20/5/2 (wld)
I have collected High Elves before, and still have my 3000-point army at home, but quit some time ago to take up Lizards. However, if most of the things ancalagon mentioned will come true, i'll definitely take up gaming with HE again. There was always something overpriced that underachieved with HE, it felt like.., but if those rumours will be in the HE rule book then i think they fixed it.