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Hi! I wanted to see what people thought of this list. It's a bit late to tweak as I'm playing tomorrow afternoon but any input is welcome. We agreed before writing our lists that the scenario type would be Secure and Control.
Ultramarines – 1500 Points
Artificer armour, Iron Halo, Terminator Honours, plasma pistol, master-crafted power sword, meltabombs and frag grenades.
Company Command Squad
Veteran Sergeant with power fist and plasma pistol, Company Standard Bearer with bolt pistol and chainsword, Apothecary with narthecium, reductor, bolt pistol and chainsword, Company Champion with terminator honours, power sword, combat shield and bolt pistol, and 3 Marines with bolt pistols and chainswords. All models (including Commander) have frag grenades and the Infiltrate skill.
Venerable Dreadnought with assault cannon, power fist and built in storm bolter, extra armour and smoke launchers.
Tactical Squad I
Sergeant with bolt pistol and chainsword. 1 Marine with plasma gun, 1 Marine with missile launcher and 7 Marines with bolters.
Tactical Squad II
Sergeant with bolter. 1 Marine with plasma gun, 1 Marine with heavy bolter and 7 Marines with bolters.
Land Speeder I
Land Speeder Tornado with heavy bolter and assault cannon.
Land Speeder II
Land Speeder Tornado with heavy bolter and assault cannon.
Attack Bike Squadron
2 Attack Bikes with multi-meltas.
Sergeant with bolter, 2 Marines with lascannons, 2 Marine with missile launchers and 2 Marines with bolters.
Whirlwind artillery tank loaded with Vengeance missiles.
The plasma pistol is a good weapon, some like it and others would rather stick with the bolt pistol due to not running the risk of hurting your own unit. The same applies for the master crafting on the power sword. (I would personally say drop it, but thats my preference.)
I would take away the meltabombs, you don't want your commander running after armour unless all the enemy troops and characters are gone anyway.
Only thing I have to suggest is consider dropping the plasma pistol from the sergeant; only because you now have a single wound model at over fifty points. (Grey knights can get away with that, they have a lot of bonus goodies that don't offer a chance to kill them when they shoot.)
Take my love, take my land, take me to where I cannot stand; I don't care I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me.
"The difference between gods and daemons largely depends upon where one is standing at the time."- Lorgar
Member of the Fluff Masters Clan
First off, thanks to darkreever for the input, always appreciated though I didn't get a chance to see it until after I'd played the game!
I didn't make notes so I can't really do a battle report (or I'd post it in the battle reports section) but I will note how each selection performed from an Army List point of view.
Commander - What a legend! Thanks to Infiltration he deployed halfway across the board and was into assault range in my first turn (thanks to my opponenet moving some kroot forward - he got the first turn)! Managed to more or less singlehandedly wipe out a squad of kroot, as well as 3 crisis suits including the enemy commander (the artificer armour paid for itself here as they had no power weapons - majority rule doesn't apply to independent characters in CC) and accompanying shield drones (6 of them, neither of us realised you can only have 1 of each type max) with an assist from the champion, then he used those 5 points worth of meltabombs to destroy a thus far unharmed hammerhead! Paid for himself many times over, and didn't even get wounded! I also feel the need to mention Rites of Battle here. How people could do without a Captain in their army is beyond me, as having max leadership for every model in my army is just something I cannot without. There were a couple of times where I just scraped leadership tests, and everytime I had to give my Commander the credit.
Command Squad - Mixed result. They deployed with the commander as stated, and their shooting and assaulting helped to see off the kroot, but unfortunately after the massacre out the kroot they didn't manage to consolidate far enough to get into contact with the battlesuits, so they were left to bear the shooting of the crisis suits (plasma rifles), a hammerhead, a squad of fire warriors and 2 sniper teams! Only the Company Champion survived and quite frankly it's a miracle he did! The apothecary saved 3 wounds even before this though so I think he paid for himself. Banner bearer was a bit wasted (Tau weren't really likely to charge me, but I liked the model). I took darkreever's advice and have now dropped the plasma pistol from the sergeant - I didn't really need it and anything you can kill with a plasma pistol you can definitely kill with a powerfist). All in all I'm happy with them though, as the amount of fire and attention they absorbed helped me tremendously. A luckier dice roll could have made them awesome but no plan surivives contact with the enemy, does it?
Dreadnought - As always my dread performed awesomely (he was even sporting a new "more bling" paint job to reward him for his previous excellence). He drew loads of fire, ignoring prettymuch all of it thanks to his venerable upgrade, as well as taking out a squad of vespid on his own with a mix of shooting and assault, then tearing up a squad of fire warriors and causing them to flee off the table! The smoke launchers also came in handy when he got a crew shaken result in the previous Tau turn, used them to dowgrade a couple of hits then in my turn I charged into the remainders of the vespid who had regrouped and wiped them out (there's nothing in the rules about using smoke launchers stopping you assaulting that I could see, if there is feel free to put me right). Claimed an objective in the 5th turn.
Tatical Squad I - usual solid performance - they were in cover in the forest the whirlwind was behind ready to intercept any attacks, but their bolter fire still managed to help whittle down the shield drones on the battlesuits, and a krak missile stunned the hammerhead that the commander later destroyed, claimed an objective in the last turn. Only took 1 casualty! Could have dropped a few marines I suppose but I am a strict adherent to the Codex Astartes where possible - that and I didn't want them to be changed to a non-scoring unit to easily in case of needing to claim an objective!
Tactical Squad II - as above, does exactly what it says on the tin - butchered a squad of kroot with bolter and plasma fire over a couple of turns then the heavy bolter rattled away at sniper teams for a couple more. Took a few casualties in turns 3 and 4, enough to knock them down to just under half strength at 4 men.
Land Speeder I - Unlucky really! Thank to my opponenet getting the first turn and a slight sparsity of cover, this speeder took a railgun hit in the first turn (how come Tau get such high ranged weapons when my lascannons are shorter range now??) which stunned it and blew the assault cannon away. Still, in the next couple of turns it harrassed the Tau with it's heavy bolter before being unlucky enough to be immobilised (and therefore destroyed as it moved 12") in the next turn! Unlucky in the end but a good performance for the points!
Land Speeder II - Quite a bit better! It was hidden with the Whirlwind from the Tau's initial barrage, and came screaming out of cover and opened up on the battlesuits (I'm not putting up with him having 2 shield drones per battlesuit again, all those 4+ invulnerable saves were a pain in the posterior) and took out a couple of drones, then in the following 2 turns it helped to mess up a squad of Fire Warriors (though only with it's heavy bolter, I keep forgetting Assault Cannons are have only 2/3rds of their range! I think 2nd edition spoiled me forever) before being immobilised in the 4th turn and therefore, destroyed. A good unit from a points earned back perspective!
Attack Bike Squadron - Extremely unlcuky. Turbo boosted from cover up the right flank in the first turn, then in my opponent's he fire an Ion Cannon from his second hammerhead at them. 3 hits, 3 wounds... 3 FAILED INVULNERABLE 3+ SAVES?!?!??! I was more than a little narked, but clung to the hope the remaining bike on it's 1 wound would survive to enact vengeance... until he shot it with a sniper team, thankfully he only caused one wound which I promptly FAILED to save!?!? ARRGH!! - Can't really comment on their effectiveness as this was entirely through crappy rolling rather than any real fault in the unit. I was gutted though as I'd just bought the second attack bike.
Devastator Squad - Good overall. My God, my oppoenent was worried about these guys. He shot basically everything in range at them in his first turn, a squad of Fire Warriors, 2 Sniper Drone Teams, the Hammerhead with Ion Cannon, and the Vespid squad he had. Even with 4+ cover saves, I only had 2 Lascannons and one missile launcher left (and they were only just in squad coherency). In my turn they shot at the Hammerhead but to no avail (my luck with lascannons is abysmal, I normally don't beat the armour or I roll a 1 on the damage table). In my opponent's second turn he got them down to one model, a lone lascannon, but he stoically kept passing leadership tests and shot at the Hammerhead again - failing to penetrate. Damn. In the following turn he weathered more fire from the Sniper Teams before yet again failing to harm the Hammerhead. But in turn 4 he finally penetrated the armour and rolled a 5 on the penetrating hit table! Woohoo! - Performance wise, they did well - they may only have killed one unit in the end (not counting the fire warrior the lone lascannon shot in turn 5 when there was nothing else left to shoot) but they absorbed buckets of enemy fire and managed to survive long enough to keep making my opponent worried every turn.
Oh and darkreever, to address your concerns - I normally like to take a full 10 man squad but I had to crimp some points so decided to do it here (in retrospect I should have taken them from ones of Tactical Squads, but hindsight is always 20/20). As for the mixing of weapons - I don't really use frag missile as my opponents are never stupid enough to group their models close enough to make it worthwhile. I would have used 4 lascannons but I saved a few points, and also I didn't want 4 of the same gun for aesthetic reasons.
Whirlwind - Solid performance. Not much to say about it really, it stayed out of sight all game as one would hope, I was a bit unlucky with scatter dice, but it still managed to kill 3 or 4 Tau from a variety of squads each turn, so it did exactly what it said in the tin. I would happily take another one in any game against any army with a majority of 4+ or worse saves... though I also want another devastator squad, but then the Whirlwind is a lot cheaper, points wise.
Well if you read all of that, thanks! As you can see I had a pretty jammy battle overall and for those keeping score, I wiped out my opponent's Army in 5 turns and won a Victorious Slaughter results with a total of 3,000 Victory Points! So I really can't pick any holes in this list to be honest! Again, thanks to darkreever for his advice!
i must comend you on your win. you took advantage of your opponents weekness's and pummeled him. i have a couple things to add though. his list was not very good at all. you can take two sheild drones per crisis suit with the proper equipment, but their very exspensive (same points as a marine each) and their were much better things he could have used those points for. like multi trackers for his tanks, kroot hounds, ect. also it sounds like his only anti tank were his hammerheads. not missle pod or fusion blaster suits. they would have been much better at killing your dread then the vespids that got slughtered. but alas, you had the better list, tactics, and mind set, despite some bad rolls. bravo.
Never give up. Never give up. HIT, HIT, HIT, HIT!
greektlake, you'll make me blush hehe.
In my opponent's defence (he is my best friend so I suppose I have to defend him), he hasn't played Tau very much, and he did take Multi-Trackers (which seem awfully good for how little they cost) and Kroot Hounds.
He said he didn't bother upgrading the suits much to save points (heh... mistake!). He also says that he wants to buy some more stuff for his Tau as soon as possible... he's even talking about getting Farsight and a load more battlesuits... a prospect I am not too overjoyed at!
How can he take two drones per suit though? They are in the wargear list and it states that you cannot take the same item of wargear more than once! But then I didn't have a proper scour of the codex.
Last edited by chrispcarter; August 2nd, 2007 at 14:21.
your welcome. you deserve it. on the drone matter. its different for drones as they arnt wargear so much as their units attached to the suit. the suit has either a hard wired or hard point drone controller. the drone controller is the wargear option. if you read about the drone controller, it will exsplain everything you need to know in full detail. also, tell your freind to stop by the tau forum here, it will relly help his list and tactics making him a better player and by osmosis, you :yes:. you can even tell him to message me personally and ill be more then happy to give him the basics of tau. always looking to help the greater good
Never give up. Never give up. HIT, HIT, HIT, HIT!
Ahh that explains it. I'll have a better gander at the codex next time I get a chance. I'll give him a nudge in the right direction if I can but I don't know if I want him to get too good, hehe.