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  1. #1
    Senior Member slobulous's Avatar
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    71 (x1)

    1850 competitive codex marines

    HQ
    Force Commander - terminator armor, storm bolter
    Terminator Command Squad - sergeant and 3 terminators, 2 assault cannons

    Elites
    Dreadnaught - extra armor
    Dreadnaught - extra armor

    Troops
    Tactical Squad - 3 marines with bolters, 1 lascannon, 1 plasma gun
    Tactical Squad - 3 marines with bolters, 1 lascannon, 1 plasma gun
    Tactical Squad - 3 marines with bolters, 1 lascannon, 1 plasma gun
    Tactical Squad - 3 marines with bolters, 1 lascannon, 1 plasma gun
    Tactical Squad - Veteran sergeant with power fist and plasma pistol, 1 melta gun, 8 bolt pistol and CCW
    Tactical Squad - Veteran sergeant with power fist and plasma pistol, 1 melta gun, 8 bolt pistol and CCW

    Fast Attack
    Land Speeder Tornado - assault cannon and heavy bolter
    Land Speeder Tornado - assault cannon and heavy bolter

    Heavy Support
    Devastator Squad - 4 missile launchers, 6 bolters
    Predator Annihilator - twin-linked lascannon, heavy bolter sponsons, extra armor

    Total - 1850

    Traits
    Take the Fight to Them -
    We Stand Alone -

    This list won me a local tournament last weekend for a $100 gift card!8X

    Last edited by Lost Nemesis; November 6th, 2007 at 05:42.
    I WANNA GET STUCK IN WIT DA BOYZ

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  3. #2
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    531 (x8)

    Hi there,

    do you want opinions on the list? Do you want suggestions for bolstering it up to 2,000 points? Tell us. You are not making a point as to what you are actually asking for in this thread.

    There's a lot of minmaximizing in the list. Nonetheless, and though I prefer to put a sixth marine into small tactical squads for scoring purposes, I think the list is perfectly okay as you seem to be sticking to a combat squad / full squad theme.
    One suggestion, though: I don't think you need the meltas and you probably took them because they are assault weapons. You would win a lot if you dropped one of the close combat tactical squads and instead bought another fast attack unit, namely assault marines without jump packs. You could have two plasma pistols, both not on the veteran sergeant (so you won't lose an expensive model when they overheat), for the price of the one on your veteran sergeant, and would have the points for the melta to spare. Another bonus would be that the unit deploys last and will leave you with some more flexibility, while at the same time leaving your opponent in the dark about where you will deploy that squad until the very last moment.

    If you plan on expanding the list there's a lot of possibilities. You'll have to decide whether you want to stick to combat squads or maybe field another marine with each las/plas squad and put a sixth model in your terminator command squad, or back up your vehicles with some more targets for the enemy anti-tank to split fire among, etc...
    You could, for example, field another dreadnought with extra armor and make the other two (with traits, or one of them without) venerable or buy a sixth terminator. Or you could buy a sixth marine in all the las/plas squads and buy a whirlwind for some indirect fire (your army, lacking fast mobility other than the landspeeders, could greatly benefit from the ability to hit targets behind cover from afar - think of Tau, for example), or a third landspeeder for additional fast moving firepower. Instead you could also consider rhinos for your close combat squads. Of course the commander also needs a power weapon! Or he will continue to look a little weird among those tactical dreadnought-armored monsters with the big fists...
    As I said: there's a lot of viable options that would make sense.

    Regards,
    Archer

    P.S.: Congratulations on your victory! For Mankind! (Reconsider your signature... )

  4. #3
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    531 (x8)

    Here's the beard that would eat your list alive, by the way!

    2x Chaos Sorcerer with Mark of Slaanesh and Lash of Submission
    6x 8 Thousand Sons and Aspiring Sorcerer with Bolt of Change

    I know it's fourteen points above the points limit, but you could drop a Thousand Son at will (and gear out the characters) if anyone really wanted to play this list.
    Advance one squad with attached HQ just a tiny bit towards the Space Marine army so that one squad has a model within 24" and the neighboring squads do not. Then Lash that one squad (preferably one of those close combat squads) and eradicate it with the Inferno Bolters. The Space Marines can answer with all their heavy weapons but won't do too much damage due to the high invulnerable save.
    If the Dreadnoughts close in, the Aspiring Sorcerers use their Bolts of Change, the six together scoring 1.83 penetrating hits on the walker on average. Once the close combat squads have been annihilated or if they don't come towards the Thousand Sons and as such pose no threat the two Lashes and many Inferno Bolter shots can totally eliminate two of the smaller squads per shooting phase. (The total of 48 Thousand Sons kill 16 Space Marines at 24" on average...)
    By turn 4 just start steadily advancing towards the objectives and continue to lay down the hail of Inferno fire...

    Harr!
    (By the Emperor - I hope there's no Chaos player out there actually considering to use this list... Though it wouldn't do very well against fast dedicated close combat lists. It is a bliss that Thousand Sons do not have uber grit...)

  5. #4
    Senior Member slobulous's Avatar
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    71 (x1)

    haha well you are not taking into account cover saves, blocked line of sight, under average dice rolls, failed moral or leadership rolls, and casualties that i would inflict on you, lowering your return fire back at me in your next turn, among other things! i would gladly take that list on! put your money where your mouth is and take me on over VASSAL

    p.s. as far as my sig goes, i am a necron player first and foremost!
    I WANNA GET STUCK IN WIT DA BOYZ

  6. #5
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    531 (x8)

    I don't know about that: there are no cover saves with the Lash of Submission (your units just walk out of cover against your will) and if there is much line of sight blocking terrain then the Thousand Sons become even more devastating at close range. But whatever... I will NEVER play an army of traitors!
    The Emperor forbid!

    Well, what do you think about making one of the close combat squads a Fast Attack choice? I am quite sure you can only benefit from that. It costs you nothing (it even saves you some points).

  7. #6
    Senior Member slobulous's Avatar
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    71 (x1)

    Ehh I considered it but assault squads can't take melta guns. One of the close combat tac squads' purposes is to take a melta shot at any dreads or other vehicles that get up close while I am advancing, if my other heavy weapons somehow did not pop them. And I don't know if you have seen that Chaos list in action before, but a couple chaos players at my place tried out very similar lists and it does look good on paper like you have explained it, but it really isn't effective. It gets overpowered far too quickly because it has no mobility, no armor, and only a 24inch range. If a single one of its units gets into close combat, then a large chunk of its firepower is gone. And if that one unit happened to be, say, my terminators or even worse a dreadnaught, the game is pretty much over. One of its major weaknesses is that it only has 6 units. You can only shoot at 6 things a turn. And if you chose to use the aspiring sorcerers to target one of the dreads, or the predator, ALL of the bolter shots are wasted. And, since it only has 6 units, I am pretty much FORCED to focus my firepower. A 4+ inv save will not save 8 marines and their sorcerer from dozens of rolls a turn. Each loss of a squad really hurts. Anyway, Do you have VASSAL? I'd love to show you
    Last edited by slobulous; November 7th, 2007 at 10:01.
    I WANNA GET STUCK IN WIT DA BOYZ

  8. #7
    That Which Has No Time Red Archer's Avatar
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    531 (x8)

    Okay, I didn't think (as I wrote above) that you really needed the Melta gun. That heavy weapon arsenal should be able to pop anything anyhow (okay, except for indirect firing platforms hidden behind terrain that blocks line of sight - but that's what I use Tornadoes for, for example). But as you do wish to keep it, switching to fast attack unfortunately won't work. It was just idea that came to my mind.
    (A short note on (veteran) Assault squads and Melta guns: well, they actually can take them, just not our codex Assault Marines. See Blood Angels (veteran squads), for instance... And I think this is very plausible. We all know Melta guns are short-ranged. So what better idea is there than to stick them with the units that are supposed to go close-up anyhow? Yes, it is two-handed, but so is the Flamer... *want Melta guns for my Assault Marines*)

    On the Thousand Sons: I do see their weakness. But consider the Lashes. The Dreadnoughts and Terminators really are the biggest threats for the Thousand Sons in your list. The Terminators can easily be kept at bay with one (or - if need be - two) of the Lashes while 3-4 Aspiring Sorcerers should pretty safely disable one of the Dreadnoughts in a single shooting phase. (They don't care about the Predator, by the way, except if it manages to somehow give cover to an advancing squad. But they can probably just advance a little to regain line of sight from a side angle.) That leaves two squads of Thousand Sons to eliminate one of your five man Tactical squads.
    If they do it right, nothing will make it into close combat. Of course if you manage to find a way to mass your whole army's firepower onto the Thousand Sons you could easily wipe out a squad of them. But as I detailed above: the army will try hard to stay at 24.01"+ from your stationary firebase and only pull one or two squads close at a time (or just shoot the close combat squads if they close in). The Landspeeders run great risk if they choose to move into range of the Assault cannons.
    Nonetheless: "eating your army alive" was not meant as seriously as it may have sounded to you, as indicated by the winking smily. I do believe that you would find a way to come by those Thousand Sons too. And I'm glad you do, because they are puny traitors worth being crushed!

    About VASSAL: I googled it once, but I didn't figure out how to play W40k there. I'd be interested in learning more about it, though, since one of my friends moved to far away for us to actually meet to play the game. If you had some more info for me I'd appreciate a PM!

  9. #8
    Senior Member slobulous's Avatar
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    71 (x1)

    yeah dude i'll help you out if you want to play VASSAL. I don't know how much you know about it, but it's exactly like the tabletop game except for the face-to-face part. It has a ruler, an automated dice-rolling system, blast templates, a chat window, everything! I'll send you a PM in a while with a link to where you download it and i'll help you get started. I'm always looking for opponents!
    I WANNA GET STUCK IN WIT DA BOYZ

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