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  1. #1
    Member hildan's Avatar
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    Building my first space marine army, need help

    Hi

    Well the title pritty much sums it up, i have begun building a Space Marine Knights of the Ravern Army - 500points. however im a little confused and would love some help in building it. I would like to have hit and run tatctics with hidden support. anyway here is what i have so far

    Kayvaan Shrike ( i know this guy is for the Ravern but i really like the looks of him and have written ia story in my head as to why hes with these guys - guess i like Fluff stuff ) - as he come in the box with no mods = 195

    Vanguard Veterans x5 - with jump packs - 125

    Scouts - 4 with sniper rifels 1 with a rocket launcher = 75 + 15 then +3 each for the stealth cloaks = 105

    Space Marine x4 - standard combat squad = 75 ???

    This amount to roughly around 500 points (if i havent calculated this correctky please let me know and advise me how to do so correctly)

    My main tatci would be to have the Kayvaan Shrike attatched to the Vanguard Veterans, jumping around with there Packs firing and moving firing and moving.

    The scouts would be hidden in various places firing light supposet and heavy (rocket launcer) for any vehicles.

    The 4 space marines are just put in there for general support but perhaps they could be removed and the points spent on better equipmet for the other troops?

    As you can see i am in need of some help, what to use and how to equip them.

    Kind Regards

    Last edited by hildan; June 1st, 2009 at 11:47.

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  3. #2
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    by 4 space marines i assume you mean 4 space marines and 1 sergeant?? which comes to 90 points i think

    you cant get less than a 5 man squad.

    and where u say u will have the scouts hiding in various places, i presume its a misunderstanding on my part but, you do know that units have to be in coherency with eachother, ie no model shud be more than a few inches away from the next.

    and my last littile niggle is that a 5 man vanguard squad with jumpacks would cost 175 pts, as u have to pay 10 points per model for a jumppack

    and i think you need some anti-tank stuff in there.

    basing it on your list i wouuld change a few things, especially kayvaan shrike, hes taking up over a third of ur points, and u mayaswell have a chaplain with a jump pack

    HQ
    Jump pack chaplain 115

    Troops
    Scout Squad(5 men) 105
    -camo cloaks
    -melta bombs
    -4snipers 1 missile launcher

    Scout Squad 105
    -Camo cloaks
    -melta bombs
    -1 missile launcher, rest boltguns

    Fast Attack
    Assault squad(5 men) 105
    -melta bombs

    Land Speeder 70
    -heavy bolter
    -multi melta

    Total: 500 points.


    reason for having chaplian is that when you assault, on your 1st turn the chaplian alows you to re roll failed to hit rolls. so stick him with the assault squad and unleash hell against infantry.

    reason i chose assault squad over vanguard was the high points cost for an extra attack. when infact with an assault squad u have 1 base attack (2 for sergeant), +1 for having 2 close combat weapons (pistol and chainsword) and u will get +1 if you charge. so for a 5 man squad you will be getting like 16 attacks (not including chaplian) when you charge which is enough for a 500 pts game

    all ur troop squads have the ability to charge a tank, but only do this if you dont put them in too much danger!

    stick the scouts in cover to sit on you objectives, using the squad with botlguns to take new objectives and snipers stay towards the rear picking off targets.

    and last but not least the land speeder, use it at its highest speed as much as you can so you have a +3 cover save, get in close with the multi melta to get 2d6 armour penetration, and when the enemies have lost all their armour turn the heavy bolter on their infintry!!!

    tested this one in a fight against eldar, and it worked
    faber est quisque fortunae suae. aut viam inveniam aut faciam

  4. #3
    Member hildan's Avatar
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    Thanks for the reply.

    Sorry im new to 40k so not fully sure on the rules yet.

    the general space marine combat squad was just going to be standard no sergant assigned, but would this be allowed? i did mean to put in 5 but my fingers hit 4.

    the scouts will be together but i was referring to various battles, one time they might be together in some trees anthor ontop of a building etc.

    I didnt realise about the additional 10pts per jump packs, i will add this on.
    which after doing so has eaten up alot of 500 points, i think i will take your idea of removing kayvaan shrike i mean although he seems powerfull to me he does take up alot of the points and with your sudjestion of the Chaplin added with the

    'reason i chose assault squad over vanguard was the high points cost for an extra attack. when infact with an assault squad u have 1 base attack (2 for sergeant), +1 for having 2 close combat weapons (pistol and chainsword) and u will get +1 if you charge. so for a 5 man squad you will be getting like 16 attacks (not including chaplian) when you charge which is enough for a 500 pts game'

    Seems like this could do some serious damage to infantry, definatly the hit and run tatic i was after.

    Thanks for the advice its been a huge help and i really appritiate it.

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    dont mention it, i mean im not the most experienced gamer ever, ive been playing on and off for years tho :p

    just throwing my bit in, and i hope u whoop everyones ass!
    faber est quisque fortunae suae. aut viam inveniam aut faciam

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    Member hildan's Avatar
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    what would you recomend for this - as i have allready bought and half painted the models mentions...foolishly

    Keeping Shrike but taking one away from the Vanguards, making up a 5 man squad there?

    so the army would be

    Shrike
    + Vanguards

    Scout Squad x5

    Combat Squad x5

    then after a while buy the assualt squads like you mentiond and putting them into the army?

    would that be allowed at all?

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    oh and u cant take any models away from a squad, u must have at least 5 models in a squad of vanguard , that is before you attach shrike to them. u can only add models on to a squad not take them away, tho it would be handy if you could lol
    faber est quisque fortunae suae. aut viam inveniam aut faciam

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    Member hildan's Avatar
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    Bugger that would of been handy.

    would it be possible to attach some of teh combat squad onto the Scouts?

    if its 90 points per 5 i assume its 18 per model.

    Shrike
    + Vanguards
    + Scout Squad x5 = 475 ponts

    +1 combat squad taking it to 493

    then add some euipment to this lonley combat guy to take it up to 500? or as hes combat squad would he not be allowed to joing the scouts?
    Last edited by hildan; June 1st, 2009 at 13:48.

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    argh, asif, i deleted my post when editing it :@

    what i said was that the land speeder fitted in with ur hit and run tactics, and can boost its self halfway accross the board in any turn, which is great for zooming about and supporting ppl!

    and u must have a sergeant in each squad, but u can arm him as a normal marine, just paint a normal marines helmet red or white to indicate his veteran staus.

    but u can use jump pack equiped vanguards as assault marines, they look practically the same except vanguard look more fancy. (only if the other player doesnt mind btw, but in friendly games it should be fine)
    ----------
    dont mention it
    faber est quisque fortunae suae. aut viam inveniam aut faciam

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    The Future realitycheque's Avatar
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    Hildan, I'm afraid you're under some massive misconceptions when it comes to building your army. Once you buy a squad, they work as a squad. You can't move some of the models into another squad, and you can't trade any members back in for more points. That squad works as a complete entity, and unless the rules for that unit state otherwise (such as the Space Marine Combat Squad rules) you should just consider it as one 'thing'.

    When it comes to building an army there are certain prerequisites - which you seem to have grasped - but I'll reiterate them in case of confusion. Lets build a 500 point SM army, I will assume you have the codex and can check the points value yourself (as we're not allowed to post individual point costs on LO). 500pt tend to have 1 HQ and 1 Troop as the enforced choices, anything more goes to the standard 1 HQ + 2 Troops.

    First up, let's pick an HQ. For a 500 point battle Shrike is a bit of overkill at almost 2/5ths of your list - a chaplain will do the job, as he comes with a free power weapon and a 4++ save (ie 4+ invulnerable)

    HQ: Chaplain - 100pts

    Now we need a troops choice... a Tactical Squad is the most versatile, and can fight better than the scouts. A squad of 10 comes with free Flamer + Missile Launcher or Heavy Bolter, which for a point strapped army is damned handy. I'm a firm believer in giving power weapons or fists to squad leaders, which gives us...

    Troop: Tactical Squad (10 models w/ Flamer, Missile Launcher + Power Fist) - 195pts

    Now we've 205 points left... a transport would be handy, to get us into the fight quickly. Tactical Squads can take Razorbacks as Dedicated Transports, and if we Combat Squad we can fit 5 marines and the Chaplain in there. Extra armour would be a good idea, as it lessens the chance your assault will stall due to a hit on the tank.

    Transport: Razorback (w/ Extra Armour) - 55pts

    Which leaves us with 150 points, but nothing that can really crack a tank outside of CC... we could fit bigger guns to the Razorback, but we really want that hurtling along at full speed whenever possible. With our 3 Fast Attack choices still free, lets make the most of them

    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts
    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts
    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts

    Note these are all individuals, rather than in a squadron. This way, the enemy will have to use at least three of their units to kill them all in a turn. Any that survive will be able to nip forward and melt a vehicle An alternate to these would be a Devestator squad with 4 missile launchers, but imo they're not as good and would struggle with large tanks.

    This gives us a complete 500pt army list, looking like this:
    HQ: Chaplain - 100pts
    Troop: Tactical Squad (10 models w/ Flamer, Missile Launcher + Power Fist) - 195pts
    Transport: Razorback (w/ Extra Armour) - 55pts
    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts
    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts
    Fast Attack: Attack Bike (w/ MultiMelta) - 50pts

    Deployment-wise, you'd deploy 4 standard marines and the Missile Launcher at the back providing covering fire - preferably on an objective point - with the Razorback (containing the rest of the Tactical Squad and Chaplain) and the 3 attack bikes as far forward as possible while still remaining in cover, and spread out down the table.

    Any questions about what I've done here, feel free to ask. I hope this helps
    Last edited by realitycheque; June 1st, 2009 at 15:56.
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    Member hildan's Avatar
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    Hi,

    thanks for the reply

    Yes im very new to the game, i do have the recant codex but not the rule book, still getting my head aorund the concepts.

    i must say i am very intreguied by the previes response of close combat attacks with chaplin and an assualt squad each being able to do a variaty of attacks while dual weilding and charging.

    i was looking at the land speeder how ever would you recomend several bikes on the field as apposed to one land speeder?

    im not sure on the tatics properlly but i was under the impretion that the landspeeder would depoly fast into the fight and while my jump pack trrops excaped, then retreating itself.

    what would be a good tatic with teh bikes, i assume that they would prove less heavy support but would there speed be benifical for flanking etc?

    Many thanks for your help

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