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Ok, so a slight preface to this. Firstly, my army is made up from both Catachan and Cadian models, and the theme is combined regiment, a bit of a city fighting army from the catachans, with a disiplined cadian element. I dislike Valkryies, because of the sheer cost of the model, to the cheapness in points on the table given how good they are, is very rude! I don't want a mech list with tons of Vets as seems to be quite common, and a lot of the time it seems autocannons and meltas are virtually the only heavy weapons in a guard army, so I wanted some variety. Oh, and I just like ratlings
CCS, Regimental Standard, vox, Missile launcher
Platoon 1 (Cadian models)
PCS Heavy bolter, 2 x grenade launchers,
Squad 1 AC and GL, Vox
Squad 2, AC GL,
Squad 3 AC, Gl Vox,
Squad 4, AC, Gl
HWS 1, Autocannons x 3
HWS 2, Lascannons x 3
Platoon 2 (Catachans)
PCS, 4 x Flamers
Squad 1, Flamer
Squad 2, Flamer
HWS Mortars x 3
Veteran squad, 3 x meltas
Scout sentinel, autocannon
Hellhound, heavy bolter, smoke launchers,
Demolisher, lascannon, plasmacannons
LRBT, hull heavy bolter.
Total 1500 pts exactly
Plan is for squads to pair up into units of 20, reducing KP, and so AC squads can form a solid firebase in lines, with Hellhound, Flamer squad and PCS with flamers, Vets all advancing, Not sure whether to bother Flanking with sentinel, or trying to keep it in lines. I know I could prob use a bit more antitank, and prob more men, and my tanks may easily get picked off because of the lower numbers of them. but I leave it open to critism and comments
Well, it is nice to see something different every now and again. I'll keep your principals in mind while running through the list.
Good. Although an autocannon is usually more effective, a missile launcher is a good choice. Especially for the CCS, as the veterans' improved BS can get those Krak missiles on target.
Ummm. Ratlings. You know what I'm going to say, so I won't say it. If you like them, then keep them. I admit I do like them myself, and they are fun, and very irritating for your opponent.
1st Platoon looks nice and balanced. ACs and GLs, make a nice combo. Not sure about that heavy bolter, but there are worse choices. 2nd platoon doesn't seem to have any voxs. I guess you ran out of points. Mortars are OK. Cheap, and annoying for your opponent. And against hordes they really shine.
Those vets really need a chimera. If you dropped the Ratlings you could give them one.
Don't bother with the smoke launchers on the Hellhound, grab another vox instead. That sentinel is best used when outflanking, as it is mobile, and your army at present seems to be infantry based.
Good. Again, don't bother with smoke launchers. You really don't need them.
Overall, pretty good. Hope this helps
2500 points of Empire for ToXG: Points painted for month 4: 0 Points painted overall: 510
Nice list, I definitely like the number of templates you've got here. You are not very low on anti-tank, I'd say. But there are some thinks I can say:
First. If you leave your vets without transport, they will get killed far before they can do anything useful. They are too low in number. I think it would better to either give them Chimera, or drop them for some other form of anti-tank.
Second. How do you want to use your Demolisher? It's good, but it's only 24" and if you want it to stand on one place all the game you are not very likely to get in range with what you are going to shoot at. If you want it to move, you are going to lose those 40 points you spent on its sponsons. If you just want them somewhere, LR BT is much better target for this. But I'd drop them, 40 points can be spent in many ways, most of them are better than this.
Third. Weapon choice. I do understand you wanted to make it uncommon, but, really, what do you need this Missile Launcher for? It is not that good as anti-tank, and if you want to shoot as a blast, you are very likely to put it on top of your own troops (those foolsloggers with flamers). Personally I don't like HB, but maybe here it would be a better choice.
Can't say anything on mortars, just didn't try them.
Everything else seems quite good to me. It requires field-testing anyway
"...But the rest of the cows and market analysts call them mad. Well, twenty-three zillion bacteria said the same thing a hundred million years ago. And guess where they are today? They're still bacteria!" (c)
you PCS nad CCS need chimeras for protection, because they are too squishy and killed easily by deep strikers etc. i would also giving your CSS melta guns for good close up anti-mc, tank etc. and 3x plasma guns and a regimental standard for your CCS.
plus if you want anti-horde SWS with flamers and demolishers ( jsut two is enough ) work nicely.
also the best weapon set up for chimeras are heavy flamers and multi-lasers.
Never take lascannon HWS, they're too expensive and don't benefit from orders as easily. Stick them in infantry squads so they get Ld8 and voxes.
Walking infantry kinda suck, so they need a commissar and power weapons to keep them sticking around and make them an actual threat. And hey, we all know how well Catachans and Commissars get along.
Vets need a ride and a duplicate unit. Redundancy is key with units like this.
Hellhounds could use multi-meltas for a little versatility, BS3 isn't great, but taking 2 of them would help mitigate that.
Demos don't need sponsons, hull lascannons suck. LRBTs kinda suck too.
Something like this might work out better.
CCS-3 meltas, Chimera
2x autocannon HWS
3x infantry-flamer (or melta), power weapon, 1 vox, 1 Commissar
Vets-3 meltas, Chimera
2x Demo-heavy flamer
Should add up to around 1500.
What ==ME== said.
The Commissar makes the blob squad stubborn. The other infantry units are cheap and disposable.
Ok, trying to take on everyones points and looking at a few things I do agree.
1. I know ratlings are pretty useless, but I do think they are cool looking, which is always a big plus, and I like that they can be an irritant to my opponent.
2. Yeah, the sentinel was going to outflank, to try to get some side shots on some armour if possible, and make a nuisance of itself for its relatively low points.
3. Part of what I wanted to do was not have any chimeras or Valkryies at all, it in the fluff is supposed to be a city fighting force, where having lots of IFV roaming around would be a big disadvantage. Some of the suggestions kind of take away from my initial wants and thoughts. I don't want to use Chimelta vets, as good as they can be. I don't want to have a mech armylist, even though the chimeras are really cheap and great value points wise, giving mobility and firepower. maybe should have made some of these things clearer before.
4. The Demo's sponsons, my bad, I misread the entry for lumbering behamoth and thought it could move and fire all its weapons. I can see heavy flamer no sponsons being a better option now.
Ok, the Lascannons HWS, I did think these were a huge point sink, but the plan given my melta vets were likely to get pounded, even with the flamer infantry in support/ covering them. My army kinda split into two halves, one attacking one sitting back, and the las gave some ranged heavy anti-tank. Autocannons were for all transports and the like, and with the current vox set up meant I could order Bring it down on both squads quite easily to make those two autos TL, and give them better accuracy. The other platoon didn't get voxes, as to give that squad it and justify it, I would have to get voxes on the PCS as well, kinda doubled up for not brilliant and fewer orders. That being said the one for the vets is prob a little redundant.
The CCS I didn't go all plasma, as it was expensive points wise, and could potentially kill my own men, and since he'll be leading from the back I didn't want to spend lots of points here on some weapons I wont fire as often. The Missile launcher is to give some versitility without it being another autocannon, and with the extra bs isn't too risky. However the more I look at it as a weapon I can see why people question it, its not really good at any job... heavy bolter was too low range for what I wanted to use them for, maybe a lascannon could do it. Also, wanted Regimental standard and vox, so only two spaces left then for Special weapons.
Hmm. MM on the hellhound I like the idea of.
LRBT suck? Can you tell me why? The idea was to give myself some more AV 14, but actually I think two Demo's fits better with my theme and with the sponson points can easily afford the upgrade...
I do like the idea of SWS, but then I looked at it, and did think I could by a PCS and make them three platoons for less points and get more orders...
I do get the advice on commisars, and getting a powerweapon in the squad as well, I assume this goes on the Commie, since any sarges might get shot in the head! but are they really worth the points? it seems like a lot to me. I mean the squads and PCS are barely more than 150pts total, for one model when you add the PW, he seems like a lot. They may well get meatgrindered anyway in assault
Doubling up on the hellhound does seem like a good idea, gives more chance one might do something... Might consider droping the footslogging vets to fit this in, gives me a different form of anti tank that still has a bit of range, and I am gonna want geting close to the enemy anyway...
I have been considering trying to fit in Marbo, though I don't like playing with special characters he is hilarious!
The mortars kinda fitted with the urban fighting theme, and were cheap.
Ok, when forming blobs, whats the ideal number of squads to put together. Too many close together reduces the number of targets you can have, too few and they are a bit more vulnerable and might not get the job done. Was thinking of my units of 20 across the board here...
The pricing in the army book does seem ridiculous, why are lascannons so expensive, a HWS with them is nearly as much as a vendetta with three twinlinked ones, and armour, and transport capacity and special rules!
Anyway, need to go away and rethink some of the list, maybe make some improvements.
Ok, I revised the list a bit
CCS, Regimental Standard, Vox, Heavy bolter (this was for points reasons...)
(ratlings are gone... a sad day... well possibly)
PCS, 2 GL, Heavy Bolter.
Inf Squad 1, GL Autocannon Vox
Inf squad 2 GL Autocannon
Inf Squad 3 GL Lascannon Vox
Inf Squad 4 Gl Lascannon (do these need the Gl? wasn't sure? and is this better than the HWS, after all its more likely to get the TL order?)
HWS 1 Autocannons
HWS 2 Autocannons
PCS 3 x Flamers
Inf squad 1 Flamer, Commisar Powerweapon
Inf Squad 2 Flamer
Inf squad 3 flamer
HWS 1 Mortars (now, honest opinion, which is better, the mortars, or the Ratlings? with the Rats I can put a Vox in the command squad and flamer blob, or drop mortars, fit in the vox, make the PCS Meltas rather than flamers and have a few left over elsewhere Maybe another couple of powerweapons in the blob?. I just think making my PCS antitank anti Mc like that is going to make it a bit more of a target)
Demolisher Heavy flamer
Demolisher heavy flamer
This fits in some if not all of peoples suggestions, but I have had to drop quite a few things to fit it in.