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  1. #1
    Member Orblivion's Avatar
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    New Player 1500 pt Salamander list

    I am just recently getting into 40k and this is my first list. Any feedback would be appreciated.

    HQ
    Vulkan He'Stan

    Troops
    Tactical Full Squad x2
    1 Flamer per squad
    1 Multi-Melta per squad

    Elites
    Sternguard Veteran Half Squad
    2 Heavy Flamers
    Razorback Transport with Extra Armour

    Assault Terminator Half Squad
    Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield for all

    Dreadnought

    Twin-Linked Lascannon
    Heavy Flamer
    Extra Armour

    Heavy Support
    Devastator Half Squad
    1 Heavy Bolter
    1 Lascannon
    2 Multi-Meltas

    Land Raider Redeemer

    I plan on attaching Vulkan to the Sternguard in the Razorback, putting one of the Tac squads in the Land Raider, and keeping the termies in reserve for Deep Strike. My main concern right now is the low number of troops. Should I maybe switch out the devastators for another tac squad?


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  3. #2
    Member hydrashok's Avatar
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    I see a few issues with your army, but maybe some of the senior members will disagree with me.

    1. You have a heavy flamer and a lascannon on a dreadnought, two weapons with entirely different ranges and ideal targets.

    2. Your devastator squad suffers from the same problem as your dreadnought. They have 3 weapon systems with 3 different ranges. If you want anti-horde, take heavy bolters. If you want anti-vehicle take multi-meltas because they are twin-linked compared to your lascannon which is not. Remember, with Vulkan you lose combat tactics so each squad can only fire at one target. Shooting heavy bolters at vehicles is a waste of a weapon, as is shooting lascannons at guardsmen

    3. You have Vulkan, who has no ranged weaponry to speak of, attached to a ranged specialist unit of sternguards forcing you to choose between wasting Vulkans CC prowess each turn or take your sternguards into CC which is not their ideal place and they then lose the benefits of all of their special ammo.

    4. Your dreadnought does not have a transport forcing him to literally hump it across the table at 6 inches a turn if you want to use that expensive twin-linked lascannon. This is also true of your second squad of marines which must march across the table at 6 inches a turn and must choose every turn whether they want to be able to fire at max bolter range and use their multi-melta or move 6 inches. As a good rule of thumb, each squad in your army should have a transport of some kind. While this is not always true, it's more often true then not.

    5. Without a locator beacon your termies are at risk of scattering and due to the fact that they are in reserve they can only arrive at the earliest by turn two and as late as turn six. Also once they have arrived on the table they have no way to rapidly relocate to meet new threats unless they arrived near your land raider redeemer.

    6. Out of your devastator squad you have 4 heavy weapons and the Sgt. with a signum. This means every causality you take in that squad you lose something important. If you are absolutely attached to this squad then I would advise packing a few extra bolter marines in the squad so that if you start to take losses from it you can sacrifice them instead of the much more expensive heavy weapon wielding ones.
    Last edited by hydrashok; January 17th, 2010 at 03:50.

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    i would put the terminators in the land raider and let the tactical squads foot-slog it

  5. #4
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    Hello,,

    Hydrashok does have sound advice. The list is not bad but needs some tweaking depending upon your opponent.. Just a few suggestions for your list.

    HQ- solid choice. Should be attached to a squad built for close combat.

    Troops - need rhinos unless you intend to have the enemy come to you and even then that would be questionable as your max firing range is 24 and then that could be a first round of shooting you could lose. Remember if you deploy first and intend to move forward you deploy up to 12 inches move 6 inches fire up to 24 inches is a total of 42 from your side on a board of 48 inches across. If your opponent realizes your list they will deploy at 5 inches causing you to be out of range of at least the troops and sternguard then move 6 and now you are in range of almost everythng they have..

    Elites

    Sternguuard w/ razorback. Forget the extra armor and use the points towards combi flamers or combi meltas.

    Dreadnought - If you choose to use the lascannon take the stormbolter or missle launcher as your list has two weapons with different purposes. Your other choice would be the Assault Cannon/Multi-Melta with the heavy flamer/storm bolter. It beocmes a matter of personal preference here.

    Terminators stick them in a land raider as they cannot assault out of a deepstrike. This will only allow your opponent to take free shots at them when they arrive via deep strike

    Heavy Support

    Devestator Squad

    Since you cannot move heavy weapons and fire the heavy bolter and lascanon are fine as the maximum firing range would be 36 and 48 inches if you did not move. The Multi-meltas are a waste as their max range is 24 for this unit. Which means your opponent wants to walk into multi melta range. Try missle launchers if it is a points cost issue as they are the same cost of the multi meltas and their max range is 48. Stick the signum on the sergeant and give the balistic skill upgrade to the lascannon if firing at a tank.

    For this 1500 point list, if your going to get rid of a squad you may want to consider the terminators. Try this as a suggestion for replacement. A 10 man assault squad w/ no jumpacks with 2 flamers in the land raider w/ He'Stan The total cost of the assault squad = 210. Now you just need to find 10 points If you take the extra armor off the razor back there is your ten points.

    or get rid of the Sternguard with Razorback which is now costing you 200 points and pick up two rhinos for your troops, a predator, a land speeder with heavy flamer = 205 (need 5 points) ... or two razor backs for the troops, a predator, with power weapons for the troop sergeants = 195

    There are alot of ideas just try different ones til you find the one you like best. You may want to tweak your list then post again for a final review.

    Happy gaming and good luck !!!

    For the Emperor
    Chapter Master Lord

  6. #5
    Member Orblivion's Avatar
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    Thanks for the tips everyone. I put this up on multiple sites and have gotten a lot of feedback, so I have quite a bit of tweaking to do. I will probably post the updated list on here some time later today.

    I'm not too sure about the Assault Squad only because I picked the termies due to Vulkan's buff. Without thunder hammers the assault squad and therefore my entire army gets no benefit from the master-crafted buff.
    Last edited by Orblivion; January 17th, 2010 at 23:48.

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    You would still get the buff on any heavy flamer, flamer, multi-melta, or metla though. As someone who also plans on using Vulkan I understand the need to make every one of his points count!

    EDIT:
    If you want to see my 1500 pts list with Vulkan and compare notes, just look up the thread in this forum titled 1500pts Drop Pod Oriented Army.

    Good luck with your games mate!
    Last edited by hydrashok; January 18th, 2010 at 00:24.

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    Member Orblivion's Avatar
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    How's this:

    HQ
    Vulkan He'Stan

    Troops
    Tactical Full Squad
    1 Flamer per squad & 1 Multi-Melta
    Rhino Transport

    Tactical Full Squad
    1 Flamer per squad & 1 Multi-Melta
    Rhino Transport

    Elites
    Sternguard Veteran Half Squad
    2 Meltaguns & 2 Combi-Meltas
    Combi-Flamer for Sergeant
    Drop Pod

    Assault Terminator Half Squad
    Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield for all
    Land Raider Redeemer w/ Multi-Melta

    Dreadnought
    Heavy Flamer
    Drop Pod

    Heavy Support
    Devastator Half Squad
    Plasma Cannon

    Attach Vulkan to the termies with the Land Raider, keep the Sternguard and Dreadnought in reserve. Both Tac squads now have transports as well. I switched up the Sternguard's loadout to give them better sv2 weapons because the devastator squad only has the 1 Plasma Cannon now.

  9. #8
    Member hydrashok's Avatar
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    This list looks a lot better. From this point on any advice that I give you is just some food for thought and personal preference.

    1. If you switched one of your tactical squads dedicated transports from a rhino to a drop pod this would mean that you would have 2 drop pods arrriving the first turn, instead of one. However, while a drop pod gets you where you are going faster and for the same points as a Rhino, it is also immobile and therefore has less versatillity then a Rhino.

    2. For your sternguard squad you could upgrade the two members that have meltas to combi-meltas for the same price. While this would reduce you to one melta shot from them per game it would also allow you to use all of their specialty ammo for the whole game. So the question you have to ask yourself is "How often am I going to be shooting at vehicles and 2+ armour saves each game compared to everything else."

    3.You are paying 115 points total for the entire devastator squad. I hope this is leagel since I am listing the points cost of the whole squad. This is esentially all for 1 plasma cannon shot at above average BS. I am sure that you could find a better use for that many points in either the heavy support or fast attack catergories. For example a unit of two attack bikes with multi-meltas would cost 15 points less. I would explore the anit 2+ save options available to me before I sunk that many points into a devastator squad like that.

    EDIT:
    I can't believe I forgot about the vindicator. For 15 pts less then your squad of devastators you get a larger blast radius with 3 higher strength. added to this is the fact that it is mechanized and is therefore a good match with your rhino and land raider. It also doesn't run the risk of getting hot and killing itself. While it has a shorter range then the plasma cannon it can move twice as fast as the devastators each turn so at best this disadvantage is a wash.
    Last edited by hydrashok; January 18th, 2010 at 01:56.

  10. #9
    Member Orblivion's Avatar
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    Yeah, the Devastators were a question, but at the time I couldn't find anything I would want. Right now I'm looking at a Predator with Twin-Linked Lascannon and a Storm Bolter, which would equal the same amount of points as the dev squad. You raise an excellent point about the Sternguard though, why eliminate their specialized ammo for meltaguns when they can just weld one onto their boltgun? I think I will stick with the rhinos for my tac squads though at this point.

  11. #10
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    HQ
    Vulkan He'Stan

    Troops
    Tactical Full Squad
    1 Flamer per squad & 1 Multi-Melta
    Rhino Transport

    Tactical Full Squad
    1 Flamer per squad & 1 Multi-Melta
    Rhino Transport

    Elites
    Sternguard Veteran Half Squad
    2 Meltaguns & 2 Combi-Meltas
    Combi-Flamer for Sergeant
    Drop Pod

    Assault Terminator Half Squad
    Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield for all
    Land Raider Redeemer w/ Multi-Melta

    Dreadnought
    Heavy Flamer
    Drop Pod

    Heavy Support
    Devastator Half Squad
    Plasma Cannon

    Attach Vulkan to the termies with the Land Raider, keep the Sternguard and Dreadnought in reserve. Both Tac squads now have transports as well. I switched up the Sternguard's loadout to give them better sv2 weapons because the devastator squad only has the 1 Plasma Cannon now.

    Excellent Job !!! Much better.

    Hydrashok's second posting is sound. Just like Hydrashok any comments here is food for thought.

    1. The Devestator squad is going to cost you 115 points and to have one plasma cannon sitting there does not offer much heavy support. There are other heavy weapon options that could do much more damage. For115 points you can get a predator, whirlwind, a vindicator or a thunder fire cannon with the tech marine. If you remove the devestator squad you could really beef up your Sternguard with three more Marines with combi weapons for 90 points and additional 15 points left over for a power weapon for your sergeant. This way you get to keep your meltaguns as well. I really would consider putting them in a rhino and letting them drive everywhere popping everything especially since the rhino has two fire ports. This unit is expensive and you want to offer the most protection to get your value back in points killed.

    2. If you have concerns about capture and control. Remove the Devestor squad and add two land speeders or 2 attack bikes that can get to an object fast to contest the objective as you only have 2 troops squads.

    Outside of this ...very well done..

    For The Emperor
    Chapter Master Lord

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