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  1. #1
    Junior Member Kommissar Waaaghrick's Avatar
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    1,000 point Space Marine army based on Chinese chess

    1,000 point Space Marine army based on Chinese chess

    I was helping a friend paint his Space Marine army and this idea came out of nowhere. I'm Chinese and I've always wanted to create a Chapter that payed homage to our culture without taking it too seriously. Somehow this Chinese chess Chapter concept came about. Each unit represents a different piece, taking its name as its shoulder emblem while mirroring its chess moves in its tactics.

    The irony (literally moving chess pieces inscribed with their literal names while playing Wh40k in reality) is so obvious that I'm certain many people did this idea before me, but anyway. I'm humbly seeking your advice on the effectiveness of the following list please (by each entry, I noted the related Chinese chess piece, where the colors of the 2 sides are traditionally red and black.)

    HQ & Elites @ 460 points

    1 Librarian (帥 red marshal, equivalent to a king)
    w/ The Gate of Infinity + another psychic power depending on the opponent type

    6 Sternguard (士 black guardians, no equivalent in Western chess)
    w/ 3 combi-melta, 2 combi-flamer, and Drop Pod

    1 Dreadnought (相 red minister, equivalent to a bishop)
    w/ multi-melta, heavy flamer, and Drop Pod

    Troops @ 410 points

    10 Space Marines (卒 black warriors, equivalent to pawns)
    w/ 8 bolters, 1 flamer, 1 missile launcher, and Rhino

    10 Space Marines (兵 red soldiers, equivalent to pawns)
    w/ 8 bolters, 1 flamer, 1 missile launcher, and Rhino

    Heavy Support @ 130 points

    Vindicator (砲 black catapult, no equivalent in Western chess)
    w/ extra armor

    Total: 1,000 points

    I put this together after reading many vanilla Space Marine lists and unit guides. I wanted something competitive yet fun to play. The basic tactics are:

    - Troops Rhino-rush, popping smoke, with Vindicator following
    - Dreadnought drop, melting tanks and flaming infantry
    - Librarian and Stenguard drop, then teleport around with Gate

    In addition to any feedback you may have, I've some specific questions please:

    - how's this list against Marine equivalents?
    - how's this list against Horde armies?
    - should I switch Troops transports from Rhinos to Drop Pods?
    - will the Vindicator be too rich a target?
    - finally, what's a good name for this Chapter?

    Thanks in advance.

    Last edited by Kommissar Waaaghrick; January 25th, 2010 at 17:05.

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  3. #2
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    , a fellow chinese!

    - how's this list against Marine equivalents?
    Other marine equivalanet armies would ahve abit more firepower

    - how's this list against Horde armies?
    Well, not very well to be honest, the only thing keeping them back in the vindicator and once they shake that or otherwise, your going to have a very tough time, you also don't ahve that much anti-armour firepower.

    - should I switch Troops transports from Rhinos to Drop Pods?
    Yes, however i would recommend a force of atleast three pods and two have the librarian with another squad so you can have a maximum impact.

    - will the Vindicator be too rich a target?
    Vindicators work best in pairs, because one is always either shaken, stunned, imobilsed or has their demolisher cannon blown off. So if theye ven manage to glance your tank, then your in trouble.

    - finally, what's a good name for this Chapter?
    Personally, i would work out the list, becfore attempting such a task.

    Also, do you feel that 1000 points is justifiable to represent chess pieces? At the moment, you risk spreading out your pawns to thinly and they will get overwhelmed by many things, because 4 man squads don't last long, even terminators don't.

    Personally, i would try to get a 1500 points army instead and grab more tactical marines (pawns) and land speeders with multi-meltas (bishop probably, but they look like stupidly fast knights) and another sternguard squad and give them both lascannon upgrades (castle) Plus no army is complete without a cutting edge unit, whether it's a termiantor squad or otherwise ( the king of course ).

    hope that helps!

    thanks
    antique_nova
    Superior stamina may win battles, but the ability to quickly recover wins wars.

  4. #3
    jy2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kommissar Waaaghrick View Post
    1,000 point Space Marine army based on Chinese chess
    HQ & Elites @ 460 points

    1 Librarian (帥 red marshal, equivalent to a king)
    w/ The Gate of Infinity + another psychic power depending on the opponent type

    6 Sternguard (士 black guardians, no equivalent in Western chess)
    w/ 3 combi-melta, 2 combi-flamer, and Drop Pod

    1 Dreadnought (相 red minister, equivalent to a bishop)
    w/ multi-melta, heavy flamer, and Drop Pod
    If you take pods, you really should go with at least 3. With just 2 pods, 1 drop on turn 1 and your opponent can easily deal with 1. With 3, 2 drops and now it's tougher for your opponent to handle.
    Troops @ 410 points

    10 Space Marines (卒 black warriors, equivalent to pawns)
    w/ 8 bolters, 1 flamer, 1 missile launcher, and Rhino

    10 Space Marines (兵 red soldiers, equivalent to pawns)
    w/ 8 bolters, 1 flamer, 1 missile launcher, and Rhino
    Change 1 of the rhinos for a drop pod. Hard as it may be, try to find the points to fit a power weapon in there (or maybe even fist, but that becomes 2 expensive). They are what wins combat against other marines.

    Heavy Support @ 130 points

    Vindicator (砲 black catapult, no equivalent in Western chess)
    w/ extra armor

    Total: 1,000 points
    I like the vindie. It's a fire magnet so it keeps the other units safe. EA isn't necessary on the vindie. They're only advisable on transports. Get rid of it and you've got 1 power weapon for your marine squad.

    I put this together after reading many vanilla Space Marine lists and unit guides. I wanted something competitive yet fun to play. The basic tactics are:

    - Troops Rhino-rush, popping smoke, with Vindicator following
    It should be the other way around. With AV13, vindicator should rush forward on turn 1, popping smoke with the troops following. Honestly, the rhino with troops is much more important than the vindicator. Your vindie should be the fire magnet.

    - Dreadnought drop, melting tanks and flaming infantry
    - Librarian and Stenguard drop, then teleport around with Gate
    Dread & sterns w/libbie drop and provide pressure. Your other tact squad drops later to grab objectives or give support.

    In addition to any feedback you may have, I've some specific questions please:

    - how's this list against Marine equivalents?
    - how's this list against Horde armies?
    - should I switch Troops transports from Rhinos to Drop Pods?
    - will the Vindicator be too rich a target?
    - finally, what's a good name for this Chapter?

    Thanks in advance.
    I like the idea of your chinese chess theme. It'll look really cool. Just hope your calligraphy is accurate enough when trying to enscribe on their shoulder pads.

    You can't ask for too much at 1000pts, and I think this list is decent enough. Personally, I'd be happy if they concentrate fire on my vindie. I look at it as a big but dangerous distraction whose 2 main functions are to threaten and to draw fire. If it dies, you've only lost 115pts but it'll soak up a lot of enemy fire.

    When you expand your list to 1500, you can consider assault marines or terminators to be your Horses and bikers or land speeders for your Rooks. Actually, the vindicator can be considered your Cannon (or a dakkapred).
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  5. #4
    Junior Member Kommissar Waaaghrick's Avatar
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    Thank you both for a lot of excellent feedback, especially the details.

    Re: Rhinos to Drop Pods. Should I convert both Rhinos to Drop Pods or just one please? I'm quite open to both ideas.

    Re: More Troops. I largely agree as I really like scoring units (I thought 5th ed's making Troops scoring units was a great idea,) but I'll have to prioritize a number of things, one of which being will Space Marines being my main army. Initially, I was planning on Orks being my main and this themed army as my fun one, but since there's so many Orks to paint, I may change my overall plan.

    Re: Extra Armor. I see your point, I'll drop that. A poster in another forum suggested Siege Shield instead, freeing up some points to invest in that power weapon you suggested.

    Re: Paired Vindies. Should I get paired Vindies or paired Dreads? It was suggested in the other forum that Dreads can get locator beacons for the Gate Librarian and Sternguard.

    I really appreciate these points and I have a factoid to share, but I'll hold on to that until seeing your responses to the above, plus other opinions people may want to share. Thanks.

  6. #5
    jy2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kommissar Waaaghrick View Post
    Thank you both for a lot of excellent feedback, especially the details.

    Re: Rhinos to Drop Pods. Should I convert both Rhinos to Drop Pods or just one please? I'm quite open to both ideas.
    I would just convert 1 so that you would have 2 dropping on turn 1. Honestly I don't like to reserve my army unless I have a way to make them come in sooner (like Guards do with Astropaths or the new Nids with Hive Commander). This is because there's always the chance that it'll come in on turns 4-5...too little, too late to help out your other units.

    Re: More Troops. I largely agree as I really like scoring units (I thought 5th ed's making Troops scoring units was a great idea,) but I'll have to prioritize a number of things, one of which being will Space Marines being my main army. Initially, I was planning on Orks being my main and this themed army as my fun one, but since there's so many Orks to paint, I may change my overall plan.
    Troops are solid, but they don't often win you the game. You need specialized units to put you over the edge (i.e. you sterns and vindicators. I also don't think dreads are game winners, though they are good in certain situations like drop pods.) 2 troops at 1K is more than enough, especially when you can combat squad them for objectives games.

    Re: Extra Armor. I see your point, I'll drop that. A poster in another forum suggested Siege Shield instead, freeing up some points to invest in that power weapon you suggested.

    Re: Paired Vindies. Should I get paired Vindies or paired Dreads? It was suggested in the other forum that Dreads can get locator beacons for the Gate Librarian and Sternguard.

    I really appreciate these points and I have a factoid to share, but I'll hold on to that until seeing your responses to the above, plus other opinions people may want to share. Thanks.
    It's the pods themselves that can get locator beacons, not dreads. I think 2 vindies are more dangerous, but if you are going that route, you might as well change all your pods to rhinos. Just 1 pod dropping is not very effective. This way, you'll also have some points leftover for power weapons/fists or anything else. Also, change the flamers on your tact squads to meltas. They have a lot more utility.
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