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  1. #1
    Son of LO IronWeevil's Avatar
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    605 (x8)

    Look Ma No vets! 1500 mechanized

    This list is primarily an academic exercise to test the effectiveness of a mechanized list that forgoes the traditional heavy armor (read AV14). It is also an attempt to see how small a point game that it would be effective to employ the FW hydras on my Xmas list .

    HQ

    CCS: 4x Plasmagun, Chimera

    CCS: 4x Plasmagun, Chimera

    Troops

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera, Krak Grenades
    IS: Greande Launcher, Autocannon, Chimera
    IS: Grenade Launcher, Autocannon, Chimera

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera, Krak Grenades
    IS: Greande Launcher, Autocannon, Chimera
    IS: Grenade Launcher, Autocannon, Chimera

    Fast Attack

    Hellhound: Hull Multimelta

    Hellhound: Hull Multimelta

    Heavy Support

    Hydra: Hull HB

    Hydra: Hull HB

    The main operational strategy is that the PCSs fill the role normally assigned to chimelta vets, supported by the hellhounds. Each pair of infantry squads will sit on near board objectives, supported by Hydra, and a CCS. One or both CCS could be tasked instead to support the forward elements, should terrain or opponent force make up require it.

    One potential revision would be drop one CCS and replace it with a 5 man stormtrooper squad w/ 2 meltaguns and a chimera.

    Praise the Emperor and pass the promethium!

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Nitrokitty's Avatar
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    To be honest, I don't see the point of putting infantry squads in chimeras, especially if their goal is to sit on objectives. Having them go to ground with Incoming! increases their survivability, and having them sit around defeats the purpose of putting them in mobile troop carriers. To me, the whole point of having chimeras is so you can run your troops where they need to be quickly. If they're static, then they're more vulnerable in a transport, whereas static foot soldiers can be more protected, thanks to orders. Also, if you've got Hydras, using two of your HS slots on them, when you only have two, seems like a bit of a waste. I think they'd be more effective in squadrons. Also, you're relying solely on your PCS squads for your anti-armor, which is dicey considering that if those transports go pop, they're in trouble. Even with the multimeltas, I don't know if the Hellhounds can really be considered effective tank killers at BS 3.

    Another point, this is just personal preference, but if you take stormies, I'd DS them, not put them in a chimera. I've found stormies to be most effective when they can just appear and waste something. For roughly the same amount of points you can have some vets with meltas in the chimera doing the same job.

    Overall, I think it's an interesting, but not very effective, exercise in list tinkering. Of course, the final judgment is how they do on the tabletop, which is hard to predict unless you actually do it.
    House Crocotta - Imperial Guard 4000
    Tomb World Sheol - Necron 2000

    Imperial Guard Tactics - The Art of Big Scary Distractions: Part 1 Part 2

  4. #3
    Son of LO IronWeevil's Avatar
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    605 (x8)

    One of the things that is driving this list is the contention from non IG players that the heavy reliance on vets is anti-thematic. On balance, I think that the PCS squads should be as effective as the veterans in tank hunting (1/2 of 4 and 2/3 of 3 both amount to 2). It would be a simple matter to swap the plasmas on one of both CCS out for meltaguns and switch them to a more forward role, should the list need more tank hunting punch.

    The mech platoons is in part theme, and in part because it's a cheap way to give some extra punch and durability to an infantry squad. It also allows for late game objective grabbing should the PCSs get wiped out.
    Praise the Emperor and pass the promethium!

  5. #4
    LO Zealot SandWyrm's Avatar
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    Nitrokitty pretty much nailed it. I'd add this though:

    Without some lascannons, Nid MCs with 2+ and 3+ saves will walk all over you. That means taking either Vendettas (preferred), lascannon Sentinels, or lascannon Heavy Weapons Squads.
    Come visit my blog at: www.warstrike.org

  6. #5
    LO Zealot SandWyrm's Avatar
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    204 (x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrokitty View Post
    Another point, this is just personal preference, but if you take stormies, I'd DS them, not put them in a chimera. I've found stormies to be most effective when they can just appear and waste something. For roughly the same amount of points you can have some vets with meltas in the chimera doing the same job.
    At 1500 I agree with this. But up around 2000, Stormies do work very well in Chimeras for outflanking and scout-striking.
    Come visit my blog at: www.warstrike.org

  7. #6
    Son of LO IronWeevil's Avatar
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    605 (x8)

    Quote Originally Posted by SandWyrm View Post
    Nitrokitty pretty much nailed it. I'd add this though:

    Without some lascannons, Nid MCs with 2+ and 3+ saves will walk all over you. That means taking either Vendettas (preferred), lascannon Sentinels, or lascannon Heavy Weapons Squads.
    Noted
    Praise the Emperor and pass the promethium!

  8. #7
    Son of LO IronWeevil's Avatar
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    605 (x8)

    Based on the feedback, I've come up with a revision. Does this address the previous concerns?

    HQ

    CCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera

    CCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera

    Troops

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera
    IS: Greande Launcher, Lascannon
    IS: Grenade Launcher, Lascannon

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera
    IS: Greande Launcher, Lascannon
    IS: Grenade Launcher, Lascannon
    SWS: 3x Demo Charge

    Fast Attack

    Hellhound: Hull Multimelta

    Hellhound: Hull Multimelta

    Vendetta

    Heavy Support

    Hydra: Hull HB

    Hydra: Hull HB
    Praise the Emperor and pass the promethium!

  9. #8
    Senior Member Nitrokitty's Avatar
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    A definite improvement over the last list, but having four static infantry squads still grates on my sensibilities. I don't like having heavy weapons in my infantry squads, since it means that squad will amount to little more than ablative wounds. I'm okay with HWS, since they're designed specifically for sitting in one place and blasting things, but having heavy weapons in infantry squads kills a lot of their usefulness. I seriously doubt you will have 4 objectives in your starting zone that you can plop those squads on top of, which means you've got a lot of points just sitting around waiting to be shot at. I know many people here don't like heavy weapon squads, but if you're insistent on making a vet-free list, you should consider them. Nothing is better than a HWS for the "plopping down on an objective and shooting things" role than a HWS. I'd much rather have the infantry squads running around the board doing things, whether it's bubble wrapping my tanks, or moving in behind my armor to grab objectives, or assaulting things to tie them up for a turn or two.

    What my issue comes down to is this: when you put a heavy weapons team in an infantry squad, you are pigeonholing them into a static fire support role, which they do not excel at. If you move them around, you're wasting the firepower of the heavy weapon, yet if you keep them static, you're wasting the versatility of the other infantry troops. I would rather spend the extra points on the heavy weapons squad to have a dedicated static fire support base, and keep my infantry squads mobile and available.

    Other issues: the Vendetta is good. Put the SWS in it. Give them 2 flamers and 1 demo charge, 3 is overkill. 4 chimeltas is a much stronger anti-armor base than before. However, I still feel like your chimeras will be vulnerable without heavy armor support to cover their flanks. I feel like this list might work, but anything it could do, the Eldar could do better.
    House Crocotta - Imperial Guard 4000
    Tomb World Sheol - Necron 2000

    Imperial Guard Tactics - The Art of Big Scary Distractions: Part 1 Part 2

  10. #9
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    I would tweak your list to this...

    HQ


    CCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera-145

    Troops

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera-125
    IS: Plasma Gun, Autocannon-75
    IS: Plasma Gun, Autocannon-75

    Infantry Platoon
    PCS: 4x Meltagun, Chimera-125
    IS: Plasma Gun, Autocannon-75
    IS: Plasma Gun, Autocannon-75
    SWS: Demo Charge X2 Flamers-65
    SWS: Demo Charge X2 Flamers-65

    Fast Attack

    Hellhound: Hull HF-130

    Vendetta-130

    Vendetta-130

    Heavy Support

    Medusa-135

    Hydra: Hull HB-75

    Hydra: Hull HB-75

    Your infantry now packs AP punch which is a threat, adding another Vendetta gives you more mobilty options as well as the added SWS flamers/demo combo... I've never seen the need for more than one Hell hound variant (while fast its still just a support unit, perfect for tagging along with one of the vendetta's and SWS) The Medusa while fragile packs serious power at range in addition to the Vendetta Lascannons...there is so much AC and LC gun fire no transport or MC could move across the table without taking 8 to 10 shots... leaving the rest of your force to clean up... Deep strikers may be a problem but they'll only get one shot off before getting vaporized by all the AP1 and 2 weapons you'd have in your backfield...

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