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Trait: Cleanse and Purify
Disadvantage: Die Standing (or whatever)
Captian with storm bolter and power weapon
Missle Launcher and TL Lascannon
Vet. sarge with P. Fist, BP
Rhino with smoke and extra armour
Vet. sarg with P. fist, BP
Rhino with smoke and extra armour
1 Plasma gun
1 Plasma gun
3 LSTs with H. Bolters and Assault Cannons
Each LST takes up a FA slot and acts independantly
Preadator Annihilator with lascannon sponsons
Total: 1498 pts
General tatics: Each Rhino will attempt to take a flank in a double envelopment. One LST will go with each Rhino, and the third LST will go where a little more firepower is needed. The two footsloging squads, the Dread, and the Pread will form a base of fire in the center of the board and support the Rhinos as needed. Any comments on Army composition or tatics are appreciated.
wow,i dont know why but for some reason i really like this list!The only thing id say is cut down the troop squad size for the lascannon squads to 6 and add an extra squad of the same configuration.
INNOCENCE IS NOT IMMUNITY
First, thanks for the compliment. This list has undergone many radical changes to get where it is. Second, I figured somone would take exception to the footsloging squads, let me defend them. The purpose of the footslogers is to be able to take on anything and to hold close objectives. With the extra bodies and bolters the squad will be able to take more fire and be able to engage light infantry more effectively. I admit that such a general purpose squad might not be the most effective use of points, but it supports everything else very well. It gives me the fire that I need to suppliment everything else. If you can give me of an example of 350 pts that can replace those two squads and fufill their purpose of supplimentary fire and stubborn objective claiming than I would like to see it.
Your foot sluggers will not take objectives, unless your in a defensive mission to begin with, in which case you could have simply deployed them where they need to be. 10 man squads are wasteful. You could field another squad having 3 squads of 6. You may think, but wait, they would not be scoring units faster, which is true, but they will kill more things, that can kill you, stopping the enemy from killing you is more impornat then being able to absorb mass firepower. The problem is with the rihnos.
You have put misplaced trust in them, as they where totaly nerfed in 4th edition, dont field them, they are 58 point death coffins, for which a good commander will use them to exploit you.
Dont field flamers on troops that move only 6"s after they get out of the rihno, you will never get another shot off, and anything a flamer can kill, so can your bolters.
Bikes would be a better choice, but you dont have enough fast attack choices, however you could fix that with a trait, and take them as troops, however thats point heavy.
You could change a trait, allowing you dudes to drop pod. They should probably be armed with melta guns however, as this is the most devistating combination to most armies.
ALL vehicels need extra armour, except skimmers. You need to make your HQ a more intrical part of your list, right now, hes terrable severs almost no purpuse, and cant hold is own is CC. A chaplain is your most point effective HQ. Peace
The commander is a weak link and before reading your post, Forged, I was planning on sticking him in with a Rhino squad. I was also going to switch his storm bolter out for a bolt pistol at least. The Rhinos are steel coffins but they have done right by me so far. The Rhinos tend to last because there are higher priority targets on the field in the form of LSTs and the Pread and Dread. If the Rhinos start falling on their face I will switch them out. The main reason the Rhino have a place in my army is because they did well the first time I used them, and honestly I only used them to see for myself how they would work.
The footsloging squads are perfectly capable of capturing objectives. For example, the way I deploy them they contest a table quarter after one turn of movement. Also, the footslogers have won a take and hold mission for me after moving towards the objective for two turns while my enemy was worried about the Rhinos and LSTs on his flanks. I admit that the footslogers cannot take any objective at will, but they can take limited objectives. The LSTs are for taking objectives at will.
I will try the six man squads in place of the ten man squads, but having one squad to back up each flank has a symmetry that I liked. Also, this is a friendly list so I don't really mind trading some firepower for pretty formations. Now that I think about it I have never tried the six man squads. I am still relatively new to the game.
For now I'll try the six man squads and put my captian in a rhino. I will see how it works tomorrow and make changes from there.
Another way you might try splitting your squads...
- Make the two mounted squads into 8 man units.
- Make the two advancing foot squads into 7 man teams with a plasma gun in each squad.
- Create two new teams of 5 men each with a lascannon and 4 bolters.
You end up with 2 advancing squads that retain good anti-infantry fire power and 2 stationary squads that can fire the lascannons every turn. The mounted squads at 8 men are also still decently manned squads. You could also try removing the 2nd spendy flamer on the mounted squads and see if you can find the points to add a second plasma to the advancing 7 man teams.
When you said that you had your foot teams on the move for 2 turns, thats 2 turns of no lascannon fire. Those 4 unused shots taken by the now camping 5 man teams could cause significant vehicle damage much earlier in the game.
BTW - As an afterthought, I realize that your captain would now also be able to ride with a mounted squad should you want him to.
Last edited by Sig121; December 18th, 2005 at 08:37.
Hmm, well, my biggest issue is the flamers, secondly the rihnos. First, your rihno is out of line of sight, second turn, your rihno uses smoke, but gets shaken, 3rd turn, its dead, are your troops out? that makes or breaks the game for you. Considering the short range of flamers, i would guess your troops just got pinned, and took 7.5 wounds from that rihno exploding, youd save most but not all. Next turn, they get hammered uber hard since the enemy basically gets free shots at them.
This assumes your opponent is good. Anyway, the choice is yours, but you should be aware if your losing more games then it seems you should, look to your list first, as from what youve said so far about tactics seems reasonable, except for the misplaced trust aspect.
As for friendly lists, in chess would your queen take a pawn or move to check mate the opponent, most people would move for the check mate, it is no different in warhammer, simply more dynamic. Honour your models and your friends by playing them to the best of your ability, that is fluff, and that is friendly, and except no less from those you play.
Firefight, you have a good list except you are missing out on a really cool (but smewhat risky) feature that makes marines really deadly in firefights- plasma guns,
As with cleanse and purify you can take two, a squad of 10 marines w/ two plasma guns (no V.sergeant) in a rhino makes a devastating squad at 12-24" that can lay down a lot of fire. Combine that with you LS you can have serious short range death (I know if your in range the enemy can fire back).
Marines can handle themselves in CC (especially with the V.sergeants with the PF) so you only have to worry about dedicated CC units and the fact that the commander (a master) can give you LD10 you will have a moving wall of power armoured death that will never runaway.
The dreadnaught is good but maybe switch the ML for its CCW and you have a seriously versatile model.
I really like the list just that I would do things differently.
Last edited by The_Outsider; December 18th, 2005 at 22:31.
Just FYI, if you post future lists with Rhinos in them a lot of the people responding will tell you to take them out because they totally blow chunks. To some degree that is true, but they still have a place in my opinion. The one key thing to using them is NEVER, EVER let your opponent have a chance to shoot them when you have something inside unless you have your smoke deployed. Even then they are risky, but if it fits into the way you want to play its a manageable risk.
As for the flamers.... The_Outsider and Forged do have a point as a pair of plasmas or meltas would be better.
Seriously plasma guns beat the hell out of flamers. I think u can keep the Rhinos (tho i never use them myself lol) but change the squads to 2xplasma guns. Then that's an uber power armoured unit pouring out a hail of plasma which rarely kills themselves by overheating. Gosh, rapid-fire both of those sqauds and a whole squad of Terminators will fall.....cool!