Need Help 40k in 40 min. Notable Diverence - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
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    Need Help 40k in 40 min. Notable Diverence

    Ive Play Orks, IG, Chaos and lost and the damned and thinkin of trying Space marines, maybe as just 40k in 40minutes but i will probabaly build up to 1.5K or so... Heres what i was thinking...

    I really like these traits... Kinda of like Gurreal warfare... all sneaky like... Rightnow im not really concerned with having uber competetive list. I want a balanced list based more off even firepower and infantry then HtH, fast attack or vehicles.

    The list is also 6 points over budget... i need help cutting it back


    -See But dont be seen
    -Cleanse and Purify

    -Fleash over Steel

    5 Man Tatical Squad (106pts)
    Infiltrate, 2x Flamers

    5 Man Scout Squad (85pts)
    Infiltrate, 3x Snipers, 1x Heavy bolter

    5 Man Scout Squad (85pts)
    Infiltrate, 3x Snipers, 1x Heavy bolter

    5 Man devistator Squad (130pts)
    Infiltrate, 2x Missile Launchers


    So any ideas in general?
    Cutting back 6 points?
    Better usage of points meeting previously stated idea behind army?
    Chapter Name and or Fluff idea?


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  3. #2
    Member MoosieFate's Avatar
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    I'm not an SM player, so I don't know the exact use of all these doctrines...

    What points is this? Also, what HQ do you have?

    Ok, I really don't see scout squads as useful when there are so many more better things out there.

    So get tactical squads, give them plasma or lascannons as you see fit, those are the really only worthwhile choices. And I would recommend getting a 7 man squad with Vet Searg and PF.

    Min/max all the weapons in your devastators.

    The infiltrate idea is interesting, but these types of marines are only good for fighting straightforward battles. With all their wargear and doctrines they would get flooded by models with multiple attacks like Orks.

    Deep strike and infiltrate are useful for disrupting your enemies, but on this scale your guys would be too isolated from each other, or they would be bunched up.

    good luck with your chapter
    Last edited by MoosieFate; April 20th, 2006 at 02:15.

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    This is 40k is 40 minutes.. or patrol clash.. It is 400pts and There are restrictions on vehicle side and the likes.

    Reason i didnt take las/plasma cannons is noone in 4ok in 4omin can have a 2+ save. ANd all the vehicles are light vehicles...So a missle launcher is just about as good.

    I do see your point with the scouts.

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    Senior Member DEADMARSH's Avatar
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    As somebody who also uses See But Don't Be Seen, I have to say at this level of game, you have to be really careful with it.

    First off, just paying for infiltration for a minimum tac squad could buy you an extra body. An extra Space Marine, 3+ armor save, 4WS and BS, etc. etc. guy. I tend to favor bodies in small games.

    Secondly, and please don't take this the wrong way, SBDBS can get you into just as much trouble as get you out of it. You really need to understand how to deploy effectively or it just makes it easier for your opponent to kill you.

    I'd suggest not worrying about using that trait just yet. In bigger games, most definitely, but not for a combat patrol. Bodies will help you win more than infiltration at this stage.

    Sniper rifles look a lot better on paper than they really are. I think this is mostly because everyone (including me) reads, "2+ to hit, 4+ to wound" and faints. The part most of us forget is that whatever you're shooting still gets an armor save. If our sniper rifles were like the Eldar sniper rifles, that'd make them more worthwhile, but as they stand, you need a whole lot of them to get much of anything done.

    Flamers can be tricky to use, which is unfortunate since they come in the tac squad box and you don't have to buy bitz or anything to get them. I'd suggest using meltaguns or plasmaguns though if you want those tac squads to function more efficiently.

    Lastly, think about adding in a Land Speeder Tornado. They're brutal in combat patrol!
    We all carry on,
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  6. #5
    Senior Member Grotstompa's Avatar
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    Well, i like the idea of a covert ops type of patrol force, but I think your armament is all mixed up.

    40 pts for 2 missile launchers is too much in a small game llke this. i know it's nice to be able to concentrate your fire, but I think one is enough. Besides, a commando unit isn't going to be lugging around so much heavy equipment.

    With cleanse and purify, I think you can go a couple of ways. Either put in a melta and a flamer, or else double up on melta guns or plasma guns. Going with meltas vs plasma guns depends on your style. if you want to stand back and shoot, take plasma. But since i think these guys will be infiltrating and end up close-in, melta would be better.

    Scouts infiltrate for free and don't need any heavy weapons. I prefer the bolt pistol and ccw's; you might even give them some frag and or crack grenades.

    The key to your force is not letting your units start the game isolated from each other. If most of them (or all of them) are infiltrating, set them all up fairly close together in a relative position that offers you an advantage. They don't necessarily all need to be behind cover, as long as the enemy lacks range to shoot at them.

    I'd do something like this:
    Tac Squad- 10 marines, melta, infiltrate
    Scout Squad- 5 scouts, BP and CCW
    Scout Squad- 5 scouts, bolters, heavy bolter
    Scout Squad- 5 scouts, bolters, missile launcher
    --400pts

    Alternatively, you could drop the heavy bolter and a tactical marine, and go with a Vet Sgt with a storm bolter and frag/krak grenades. The extra point of leadership the vet gives could mean the difference between winning and losing should you have to make a morale check. Or, you could drop the heavy bolter and frags, and put a flamer in the tac squad, or give the sgt a power weapon.

    NEWAYZ

    Hope that helps.
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    Update

    Im at work so i cant post new list with the points but i appriciate the comments.

    As far as infiltrate. I absolutly love it it is my favorite of the universal specal rules. I use it in both my guard and chaos armies. I completely agree that a bad set up of infiltrators can go terrably terrably wrong and have had that happen to me a few times.

    After running the numbers i completely agree with you about scouts with sniper rifles. I think i was blinded be the fact taht ive never had an army that could use them (save guard when i chose not to).

    After using excell a little bit today i see their excessive uses against, T5+ units with good armour, which i would encounter few of in 40k in 40minutes.

    I haven decided wether to keep a squad for the benifits of pinning weapon or not yet. But i probabaly wont.

    I like the idea of smaller squad as apposed to large ones. Not so much for tatical reasons but it makes more sense in my head In real life to have 2- 5 man squads doing covert opps rather then 1 - 10man.

    Ill chcek point/other then when i get home, check Cleanse and purify see if i can take 2 plasma, if not ill probably plasma/flamer that squad. Right now im leaning tword soemthing that looks like this.

    From memorie i this comes to 321pts (ish)

    Vetrian Squad
    5 men, Plasma, Missile, Infiltrate

    Tatical Squad
    5 men, heavy bolter, Flamer, Infiltrate

    Tatical Squad
    5 men, Plasma, Plasma, Infiltrate

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    New try

    Think this is better, ideas? (396pts)

    Vet. Squad (105)
    5 marines Bolters, Heavy bolter, Plasma gun, infiltrate

    Tatical Squad (110)
    5 Marines Bolters, 2x Plasma Guns, infiltrate

    Tatical Squad (101)
    5 Marines Bolters, Heavy bolter and flamer, infiltrate

    Scout Squad (75)
    5 Scouts bolt pistosl and CCWs, missile launcher, infiltrate.

  9. #8
    Ghost of LO ForgedInTheFurnaceOfWar's Avatar
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    If your squads where 6 man, they would be much more difficult to stop.

    5 man squad must lose 3 marines to count as below 50%.

    6 man squads must lsoe 4, the differance is winning and losing.

    Id also suggest you pick mission for your squads.

    Also, you could save points by being chaos, but heres marines:

    6 man, 1 ML, 115 (anti tank/heavy infantry)
    (the ML can also be used to kill massed troops)

    6 man, 1 heavy bolter, 110 (anti infantry)

    8 man squad, sgt powerfist.

    Everyone with infiltrate.

    Getting rid if infiltrate would also help.

    Now the enemy needs to kill 13 models to bring you below 50% with your army, yours would require 12, some of which have 4+ saves.

    Just a random idea, i have no idea if it would be any good or not, but:

    6 man tactical squad, 2 plasma guns 120,
    razorback, extra armor, 78

    6 man tactical squad, 2 plasma guns 120,
    razorback, extra armor, 78

    This could be interesting, (think razorbacks are legal?)

    Anyway, your tactical squads would either start outside the tanks, and lay down firepower for the first time, added by dual twin linked heavy bolters. Or the tanks and the squad could advance to take an objective or something.

    Probably not tactically sound, and totally worthless in larger games, but it might be fun, peace.

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