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I need to shave off 35 points and im not sure where, im tempted to loose my Anti-Tank squad and just put more anti-tank ability into my platoons, does this sound good? This would also give me an extra doctrine point.
Close Order Drill
Special Weapon Squads
Heroic Senior Offiver, Power Weapon, Bolt Pistol, & Surveyor, Iron Discipline;
3 Guardsmen, 1 Veterans: 1 Standard Bearer, 1 MortarAnti-Tank Squad88
5 Veterans 3 Meltaguns13Veteran Sergeant70
5 Veterans 3 Meltaguns13TROOPS70
Platoon 265 HQ
Junior Officer with Honorific Imperialis, Bolt Pistol and CC Weapon 4 Guardsmen, 1 MortarPlatoon 265 Squad 176
9 Guardsmen, 1 Sergeant; 1 Grenade Launcher, 1 Missile Launcher.Platoon 265 Squad 283
9 Guardsmen, 1 Sergeant; 1 Grenade Launcher, 1 Missile Launcher.Platoon 265 Squad 383
9 Guardsmen, 1 Sergeant; 1 Grenade Launcher, 1 Autocannon.3rd Armoured Fist83
9 Guardsmen, 1 Sergeant; 1 Flamer
Chimera with Multi-Laser and Hull Heavy Bolter.FAST ATTACK72
Inferno Cannon and Hull Heavy Bolter.Hellhound115
Inferno Cannon and Hull Heavy Bolter.HEAVY SUPPORT115
Leman Russ Demolisher
Demolisher Cannon, Lascannon, Multi-Melta Sponsons.Leman Russ195
Battle Cannon, Lascannon, Heavy Bolter Sponsons.165Total:1,500
Last edited by Mcgrath50; April 2nd, 2007 at 22:36.
Righty list advice time....
1. senior officers arnt worth it, JO with honorifica or HSO
2. why meltas in a leadership command drop both.
3. surveyor is useless in this squad, the only gun that is powerful is out of range of infiltrators.
4. where are the commisars going? one in the main command obviously but where to put the second one?
5. lascannon squad seems fine but i might change my mind when i get to the infantry.
1.dont give flamers to vets. go three meltas in the first squad and drop the flamers for something else in the second squad.
2. vets are possibly our worst cc unit. the power swords dont seem to be needed especially as they are footslogging vets
3. without drop troops these guys will die very quickly, with drop troops at least they will be useful first, drop them in and dont take upgrades on the vet sarges.
1. autocannons are nice but only after all ther bases have been covered IMO. id change a couple to missile launchers for extra anti tank .
2. command seems ok though they could do with a mortar if you are using them for Ld
3. The armoured fist is illegal it has two special weapons and only 1 is allowed
4. the platoon command costs 66 points not 67 you have paid for the close combat weapon which is free.
Fast attack and heavy support seem fine.
Your main problem in this list is optimisation. Each unit doesnt really seem to have a goal il place them how you have them and then suggest how i think they would work better,
3 anti tank squads
3 anti skimmer/transport squads
2 anti infantry tanks
2 multipurpose/ anti heavy infnatry tanks
2 anti infantry squad
1 LD squad
now as you can see your anti tank relies on a pretty flimsy lascannon squad which is also expensive.the other two squads arent even going to get near tanks.
the one anti infantry squad is anti infantry as a loose term it wont do much the other is ATM illegal.
1. so id make the AF legal
2. get drop troops
3. give the vets meltas and make them two five man only melta drop squads.
4. swap two autocannons to missile launchers to make anti tank squads that can help with other roles
5. drop the meltas from the command and make them an LD squad your list is then
2 LD bubbles
3 anti tank squads
2drop anti tank squads
1 anti transports/skimmers squad
1 anti infantry squad
now the anti infantry seems lacking but if you give the commands mortars thats a little more, you also have your tanks which are all best employed anti infantry first.
Two LD bubbles may seem excessive but if you decide to drop the AF squad and lascannons and go for another platoon it will be invaluable. It lso gives you redundancy and an easier set up.
Alternatively the platoon command could drop the honorifica and be given meltas to drop in with, the second vets squad could then be set up as a line squad in an anti infantry role .
As for finding 35pts id tweak the list first
hope that helps
Thanks for the help, just got a couple of questions and comments:
1)I''d prefer to change my SO to a HSO so then my JO can keep the Honorifica giving me two strong leadership bubbles, is this good or a waste of point in your opinion?
2) Meltas are gone, should I replace them with anything else?
3) The Commisars are going in each of my Command Squads, the HQ one and the Infantry one
4) Small Vets, that drop troop in sound good to me, i'd be looking at using them to out-flank/go behind a unit that is about to be or is in cc with my line infantry, or to capture a lightly defended objective... is this a good tactic?
5) I'v read on this forum mortar aint worth it unless you take heaps and then it is only just there, what are your comments on this?
6) For the AF I was looking at them being similar to the vets; giving my shooty army a bit of mobility for capture the objective games and to move up to support the line when engaged in cc, is it worth the point or should I just drop it and get another infantry?
Thanks for the help, ill make some changes to my list now, they will be highlited in red
Just by making those changes I now have a points total of 1,486! Now going through the list I think it might be good to drop the special weapon squad (autocannon) and the AF and just get some more infatnry, with more special weapons.... Also tempted with a basalisk to give me more anti-infantry and anti-Light tanks
Last edited by Mcgrath50; April 1st, 2007 at 01:24.
Looking much better il do your list point by point!
1) I think it is a good idea considering you will be using both as LD bases
2) I cant remeber where the meltas where but if they were where i think they were morats in the commands can be good if you have the points, see below.
3) Okey doke, just remeber that their ld doesnt confer to the other squads.
4) As you have decided to use meltas id suggest to use them against anti tank as a priority, the mission you have suggested could be secondary, for example say you were fighting my all infantry army, thre are no tanks so dropping behind my lines to assault a command squad would be the best idea. As you cant assault on the drop its always a good idea to plan on assaulting if you are lucky. In short go for the tanks first and the CC second (especially as you cant shoot into combat)
5) mortars have their uses. Yes they are bad but they are also cheap and fire indirectly. In a command squad that isnt in LOS as they are for LD purposes it can be worth adding in a couple of mortars. In a gun line army they are an added nuisance and the 20 points needed in this case wouldnt be too expensive. If you cant find the points dont worry they are extras. (en masse though they can be brilliant, i have a whole heavy weapon platoons worth in the making mmmm pinning).
6) I think that its a good stop gap. The chimera has access to the multilaser which (i rave about this all over the place so you may see i now and again!) is an amazing weapon.
the mobility is needed and the heavy firepower thrown out by the chimera makes up for the lack of heavy weapon in the squad. I say keep it.
From a modelling point of view its another tank so all fun and less infantry to paint which can get v boring.
From another practical point of view it will also survive for a fairly decent time as there is a lot of other armour that is more dangerous to the enemy.
s for the other comments. Id stick with the list how you have it now. It is playable and gives a variety of options. Basilisks are fun however in this army it isnt really needed. Overall this list is good if you play and find you have bits you dont like try other things but personally id say get the heavy weapons and tanks (you can buy an infantry box later and build the rest of the squads quickly with a reshuffle!)
hope that helps
Thanks so much for your help, you seem a bit non-plussed about commisars, should I continue to take them? or are they a waste of points.
Continuing on the 'pinning them so we can shoot them' theme of mortars I am tempted to take ratlin snipers, I would probably have to ditch 1 of the lascannons or possibly the whole team...
Apart from that I think my list is pretty well rounded.
Commisars are good for their points, the stats and abilities make them. Its just well they are difficult to use. Mine end up just being another warm body. they can and do work well, they are also fluffy so id take them itd give your army extra character.
As far as ratlings are concerned tey have been nerfed by the present rules. Eg. they equal toughness of the creature good but when i fire at grots that makes them strength 2??? they have shoddy AP aswell. The only creatures worth shooting with them generally have 2+ saves which is ridiculous, thye are in need of a special rule to make them ignore armour on a 6 or something. Personaly id stick with the lascannons. slightly more versatile aswell.
Plus you havnt put up drop troops as one of your doctrines which means you are going to be at five so cant take ratlings anyway!
glad i could help