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Hi, I've finished up my Ogre Kingdoms, and am starting a new army, and since I found the South Lands army list too cheesy, I decided to settle for the Rise of Sotec army list.
Any thoughts on the armylist itself?
I know I'll be using some rank and file crest skinks, but will also try to fielf some swarms and lots of skirmishers.
Should I try the magic side of it, or the CC as 2 skink chiefs are 1 choice.
"Magic side" like in normal LM or HE or other armies that get to choose level 4 wizards with special rules is not existing in a Red Crest Army. That does not mean, that you should neglect magic. It's just you wont be special or even strong.
Were is the southlands list too cheesy? It's incredible overpriced and weak in the core section.
Not really when you think of it, here is why.
You can field 2 skink caracters for the price of 1 lord choice, having up to 5 mages at 2000 pts, get to run around whit lots of skirmishers all day. the hornedone riders are really good for 21 pts, fast cav, no stupidity, so they are very hard to catch without them having the honor of the charge.
And they can still have saurus and kroxigors and temple guards, in a not very restricting manner.
OK, at 2.000 pts, you use two thirds of your points to get 5 equipped level 2 wizards. That's one more than every other is race allowed to choose plus this mages are restricted to only a single lore - a good lore indeed.
The horned ones are vulnerable cause the do not get any AS beyond the one for riders. Plus they do not get any ranged weapons, so they do not receive the whole benefit of the fast cavalry rules like Black Riders for instance.
Skirmishing troops as main combat unit is not so good because you won't get any rank boni, but you can get outnumbering boni by using multiple small units (MSU) charging one opponent. And skirmishing troops as core choices en masse is not something found only in the SL list.
Nonetheless all core skinks got only WS 2, so they won't hit much and be hit by nearly everything else. The low T makes it even worse.
So counting everything together it will be - no cheese in my judgement. I have to say, that beyond the possibility of a single additional level 2 mage and a fast cavalry unit instead of a heavy cavalry unit plus some worse hitting, expensive rank and file unit witth low toughness and no armor beyond shields, there is no difference to the LM list, except that I am not allowed the really powerful Slann.
Or is in your eyes the normal list cheesy, too. Then I would have to agree that the SL list is cheesy.
Don't get me wrong. The SL list is not really weak watched as a whole army. It's just not incredible strong compared to the other armies.
As rank and flie troops the saurus are still pretty available as special choices, so thids should not really hurt the spot in the army.
Not really, because you can only have one unit of Saurus per Saurus Scar-Veteran, which means you can only have one unit in 2000, and that means you aren't getting your 5 Mages as you detailed earlier.As rank and flie troops the saurus are still pretty available as special choices, so thids should not really hurt the spot in the army.
Also, the Southlands list ain't all that bad. Ranked up Skinks sound horrendous, but they get rank bonus. Combine this with the flanking Skirmishers and rear-charging Skirmishers and you can easily go in with 8 CR (Standard, Outnumbering, Flank Charge, Rear Charge, 3 Ranks), that isn't all that bad. Replace one of the flanking skirmishers for a solid unit like Horned-Ones or Kroxigors and the enemy wopnt get their rank bonus either. Obviously any unit from any army can do this, but Skinks will have an easy time of it with M6.
You cannot win, for to fight us is to give us power.
And they may do this in a "normal" LM or Red Host army as well. So nothing special about SL.
I never wanted to say, that the SL list is bad. My only point was that it is not cheesy (or at least not more cheesy than the other two LM lists).
To get B2T:
For tournament-style games:
I would go for CC with magic support. At 2.000 pts you've got to get Teenie, so is is your magical base. Then I would go for 2 Chiefs as the second character choice and to lvl 2 scroll caddies as choice three and four.
Thats a decent magical defense and a good base for CC. The rest is up to you.
For casual games between mates:
Do not use scroll caddies, for they are not fluffy. Use fluffy priests instead.
Well with all the priest I'll have at 2000, I won't need more than 1 scroll, having a lv 3 and 2 lv 2 priests will kick in enough dispell dice.
how about red crest units? they don't have javs, and I fear I'll go with 1 saurus block and maybe one of them? the rest will fly by skirmishing!
Don't go on to many skirmishing units.
They are good as support but not as main battle units. CCs are won by CR and you wont get that high CRs with skink skirmishers.
EDIT: Sorry, had to get my lunch.
1 lvl 3 mage with fixed equipment and 2 lvl 2 mages are not that good vs. magic using enemies like HE or DE. Only one dispel scroll is the absolute minimum against this opponents under serious conditions. If you play just for fun thats another matter.
Imo there is fluffwise nothing as worse as scroll caddies. Most time I play for fun and don't get more than a single DS.
Last edited by mebtvde; May 10th, 2005 at 13:44.
Yeah that's why I'll have a single scroll, to go fluff wise and competitively too.
I'll post an armylist thursday or friday, please check it out for comments and suggestions.