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new to lizardmen and starting with the battalion box a slann mage priest a siking shaman a cold one commander and a skink warchief also in time will be adding more sauras warriors and thigns like terradons and such. what are the best tactics to use against a skaven player, bearing in mind i want a very magic heavy army. Also a Goblin and tomb kings army! any advice welcome cheers for now
sry dont really know much about facing tomb kings or skaven, but my friend started a goblin army so i have some ideas about how to fight them.
if its a horde army, while it sounds wierd i'd suggest avoiding big units of night goblins, etc. with saurus, unless you can get a charge and flank, just cause theres so many that it makes combat resolution a real pain to win. try shooting them up with skinks and salamanders, since there only T3, and dont have a great armor save to reduce their initial numbers.
oh and watch out for throwing nets, they can be really annoying (reduces strength by 1, so saurus would be on a 4+ to wound in most cases).
Hey, welcome to the cold-bloods.
My advice is to make a generic list and learn the strengths and weaknesses of the different armies as you play. I find that it takes all the fun out of the game when you create specific list against specific armies.
That said, I will happily give you a few pointers.
1) Just because it seems weak is no cause to ignore it. Especially where goblins and slave rats are concerned. They are too often ignored, and if your opponent plays right can work around to your flank while you try to focus on the stuff that seems more important (orcs, clan rats, rat ogres, etc.). That's bad. These are armies that will almost alway outnumber you, and you've given up your rank bonus and +1 CR to your opponent for flanking you. Even worse when when fighting vs. fear causing units because now you're outnumbered and pretty much forced to run.
2) Skaven have a rule that lets them shoot into combat. This hurts. Sure he will kill some of his own models, but his guys are cheap. Your's are not. Especially when he hits you with a warpstone cannon.
There are quite a few ways to deal with this. Try to get your skinks and terradons up and shoot at the crew or even charge them in. There is one rat war machine with a rule that says "they must flee if they are charged".
3) Skinks scout. Use this to get them to vantage points (ex. close enough to shoot at giants, war machines, or somewhere where they can block an enemy from marching.
4) Skink shield. skinks make for a good meat-shield. While setting them up to be sacrificed may sound mean, remember that they are naturally squishy. Oh, and you have very little shooting. You want to have something to cushion, if not stop range attacks from reducing your 20 saurs to 10 before you make it in to combat. Combat is where most of your army excels. Get there alive and in one piece and you'll see excellent results.
5) Saurs are your bread and butter. Do not leave home without them.
Watch out for slaves! the cheapest models in game but can still do damage if they get a flank charge. Skaven troops will simply laugh at the slaves as they die in droves, meaning they won't cause panic tests. Also at something around a 1/7 the cost of of a saurus , he can have some real fun tieing up blocks of saurus and letting fly with poison wind globes, ratling guns, and warplighting without having to worry at all if the slaves bite it.
Also watch out Plague censer bearers, they are a relativley inexpensive skirmishing unit that hits as hard as chosen chaos knights on the charge, with a nasty little rule that could have your lizards choking to death on their fumes.
Biggest skaven weakness is flank charges. Skaven get a bonus to leadership revolving around large their rank bonus is, so flank charging get rid of some of their ungodly static CR, and their pretty good LD.
So with some careful baiting and fleeing from some skinks and some fast moving units, maybe throw in a little fear causing units and you should be alright.
last thing i need to mention is the comet. On the off chance you do get it it can really ruin the game for a Skaven player. I have had victory in my filthy little paws before only to have the comet crash down on the last turn and panic just enough units to end the game in a draw.
the replies above cover the majority of what i would of said... but on particular's for skaven (some more) :
night runners or gutter runners will hurt... in combat with your skinks they'll likely win every time (although you should be able to stick around a little better thanks to cold blood)
although your saurus are "teh bomb" in combat, a solid clanrat unit can hold itself in place with enough numbers, and leave you vunerable to all the ranged and spell-based nasties that skaven have (a single ratling gun can drop a rank of saurus with a good round - or a rank of skaven if it misfires, but that's for another topic), so try and ensure that the combats you get in will be heavily biased in your favour (flank charge, saurus hero, the celestial spell that allows you to reroll 1's...)
especially with a slann, you'll have magic dominance for a large part of the game, however should your skink priests stray too far from your army, then a well-placed assassin, gutter runner unit or even night runner team can start pouncing on you, and this will leave saurus units open to warp lightning.. which is bad.
Generally, grab a couple of strong saurus blocks, get a small bit of cavalry (or use a tooled up saurus hero), and some supporting skinks to watch your flanks, and you wont go far wrong, and should you lose the game, look at what influenced it (a flank charge, outshot, outspelled...) and tweak your list to be stronger in that respect, until your not losing anymore
Can't believe I forgot this one.
If you hit them on the flank, they no longer get their rank bonus OR their +3 to leadership. A fear/terror causing unit to the flank can really mess them up.
All these guys are spot on. I thought I should mention what pissed of my friend as he played skaven vs my lizards and lost horribly. A big 25-30 saurus block with fear causing ability (the slann in there) is way effective with quetzl as their mark. Saurus cavalry for flank charges are awsomeness (fear as well). And a scar-vet with seven attacks on the charge with your cold ones tends to mince things up pretty bad. Kroxigors are a bit of a waste in my opinion, but scouting skinks and terradons are priceless. Clestial shield rocks, 4+ ward save anyone?
P.s. Ow and if you get that spell which causes fear its a bonus. Terror is useful vs skaven :yes:.