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Beating the dice odds

2K views 44 replies 26 participants last post by  <<Imolatis>> 
#1 ·
Dice rolling is one of those things that allows even the weakest army to potentially come out ahead. However, I recently played against a guy who has perfected his rolling technique. One average, he rolls 6's about 50% of the time! Amazing right? It gets even worse; this guy plays a genestealer army, which means he rends on roughly half of all his attacks! At first, I couldn't help but suspect he was cheating, so I requested that he use my dice instead, and he still rolled 6's half the time.
To start, he holds the dice a foot above the table and allows them to roll off his palm. The dice makes two entire rotations, before leaving his fingers. Upon hitting the table, the dice turns three more times, before landing. About half the time it lands on a 6. Of course, I'm unable to produce this affect. I told the guy he should go to Vegas, and he told me that was precisely where he'd been the past few years. It did not help that he was a pretentious prick that raved about himself. At any rate, I'm wondering if there is a rule that might prevent what he's doing, though, I can't imagine what that rule would be.
 
#2 ·
I believe the rule is called the Odd Modifier Slap of Gribblyness. No there is no rule against perfecting your dice rolling technique, except the one called "good sportsmanship". Hey, what can I say, I don't mind losing, but, not if you're going to be assinine about it. Personally, I just wouldn't play them again.
 
#3 ·
Boyd we are two of a kind my friend just drops his dice and they land on the same faces its so frustrating i told him too stop but he said he wouldn't unless i found a rule prohibiting it (and he doesn't understand its called ROLL to hit not DROP to hit) but try getting him to roll your stuff and you roll his it worked for me!

NOTE:Why is this in the chaos forum? :huh:
 
#6 ·
As Hersh pointed out there's really nothing to hold against him besides sportsmanship... you could always buy a really small dice set and then offer to trade dice during the game per turn. I have one of the small dice sets and it always "honest" dice rolling.

A guy were i play microwaved down one of the sides of the dice he has to increase his chances of 6's. The GW guys caught him, now he has to use store dice. I personally didn't care he did it because he failed all his leadership checks:)
 
#7 ·
You could go for the ever so viscious "touch-the-dice-before-he-rolls-them"-trick.
Just like some people seem to be able to control the dice with their mere precense a little touch on the dice from the opponent can make all that luck of theirs go out the window.

It could be done in many different ways but I must suggest you not to be all to obvious.
Don't just start meddling with the dice as he is about to roll, you should be cunning.
Give him a dice when he needs one, you know when he sterts to count up the number of attack-dice he'll use- hand him the ones he needs.
Then stand back untill it's to late for him to respond. Preferebly in the moment when the dice leaves the hand. That's the moment to say "I touched them you know...":rolleyes:

This will make the gods of luck weary and they will not be sure weather to bless or curse the dice and the outcome will be well below the norm for the normally blessed roller.

This effect may stick with him for a while after as the dice-gods do not like when things are getting to complex.

He might hate you when he returns from Vegas next time...
 
#8 ·
I don't know about the enviuroment of the place that you play, but if he is the only option negotiate before hand rolling rules. If he won't agree then don't play him. Once, other learn that you won't play him others will join in and he will find it lonely in a world of 6s.
 
#9 ·
I roll and drop my dice, usually roll masses of dice and drop the low amount of dice, I do fairly good, but it really a mattter of the dice not flying off the table:rolleyes: .
 
#10 ·
A dice box does help also. Have a flat box, any one that has a tank will do i.e landraider box, etx, and say "lets roll all our dice in this box" that way he has to drop his dice into a flat surface.... and since cardboard tends to bend a little it will allow for a bounce effect:)

actually we use the dice box where i play so that dice don't fly through tons of minature... we had a guy who insisted on rolling the scatter dice right at the minature he was aiming at... i hate that guy

when all else fails, a "Ha! i touched your dice now they have my bad luck!" followed by a manical laugh usually breaks the tension... when all else fails use humor opponents usually have no idea how to react
 
#11 ·
Personnaly, i think that your dice results are baised on your attitude. Because theres time were i was losing and i kept getting mad and my dice rolls just got worse. but when i decided in a last stand to charge my 10 CSM's into a pack of 15 wolfen.. people thought i was stupid... till i came out alive... but hey maby thats just me.
 
#12 ·
I just can't believe this. That guy must be one of the most pathetic wastes of space I've ever heard of. It makes me angry how worthless his life is and I don't get angry often. How long must it have taken him to calculate the mechanics of getting it to topple onto a six, and then train his arm so that he stood at exactly the right height above the table? What a loser.

Same with the microwave guy, FFS it's a game for FUN, how much of a loser do you have to be to modify your dice so that you win at warhammer? What, is he afraid to learn tactics or something? Afraid his mummy might see him lose?

It's not cleverness or skill, it's cheating! The game is balanced for random elements and if someone removes the random elements, no matter how they do it, then they unbalance the game and that's CHEATING. If someone can control dice rolls then they should play with a computer randomizing program. Having a technique for rolling dice so they come out with 6's more often than once in every 6 rolls is as much cheating as using loaded dice.

He just doesn't get it, it's not the DICE that are important, it's the RANDOM factor. :realmad:

Sorry for yelling. I don't quite know why this made me so angry... I guess it just makes me feel sad for humanity that such a narrowly focussed, petty person can get through life without someone slapping it out of him. There's no way I'd play someone like that, and I would have trouble being friendly towards them too. That attitude may be OK in Vegas where it's you vs. the big bad casino but not in a fricken game of warhammer.
 
#13 ·
Just do what craps players do. Put the dice in a little cup, shake the cup, then drop the dice out of the cup.

I dunno', make it a house rule or something.
 
#14 ·
I do alot of roleplaying as well as wargaming, and dice are a very big thing. There are lucky dice, rigged dice, cursed dice all that BS, but when it comes down to it, unless you have a Phd in Physics, and can calculate the exact trajectory and speed etc. of the dice and the height they fall from, it is impossible to rig it to roll 6's all the time.

As long as you actually roll it, and not just pick them up and drop, the numbers should be random. (Unless the dice are weighted, or have 6's on every face).
 
#15 ·
Thats not entirely true, there are a few guys where craps are their life, and have perfected their rolls. There is a technique, I watched some History Channel special on em. I believe they are now banned from vegas, but they made a messload of money doing it. It has been a while since I saw the program. But there are people who can do that kind of thing. You just have to be shown how.

And yes, that makes me angry as well, that people could go so low as to cheat at a game for fun. Or cheat at all. But hey, what can ya do? I would just use my manipulation skills to ostracise him and eventually break him into playing sportsman like.

But thats just me.

-Centum
 
#16 · (Edited)
Basically, dice are supposed to be a randomising factor, pure and simple. That is what people reasonably assume and expect. Any deliberate attempt to interfere with the randomising performance of the dice should be regarded as cheating. Effectively this was tantamount to using loaded dice. The fact that it uses personal skill instead of doctored dice is not a reason to permit it.

Technically, Games Workshop have not written a direct rule to tell people how to roll dice fairly, but they presumably did not think they had to. I am sure they would if stunts like this were more common-place.

They DO however promote good sportsmanship. And that is something this guy is not displaying at your battles. In fact he is displaying the least sportsmanship I have heard of.

Basically - refuse to play with him until he stops that stunt. Threaten to tell everyone within your local circles that he 'cannot' play a fair game. Make him use a dice cup.

Remember, it is a STUNT, and it is not FAIR.

Personally, I would have let him have maybe one turn doing it, and then I would have abandoned the game, insisted it was a draw and gone to find someone who was prepared to fight fair. In a tournament, I would have used my considerable powers of persuasion to get him disqualified for poor sportsmanship.

 
#17 ·
Rather than using standard dice, one could just you a program. For example, a program that generates integers of one to six randomly. That way, the guy can't use his superior dice-rolling skills to outmanoeuvre and literally blast us to bits as there won't be any dice to roll. Microsoft Excel, Macromedia Flash and various hosts of programs designed to program files are good for this.

For example, in Microsoft Excel, click on a cell, type in:

=INT(RAND()*6)+1

Press F9 to generate a random number from 1 to 6.

EDIT: Of course, you'd need a computer handy...
 
#19 · (Edited)
Da Mighty Camel said:
And it would remove a little bit of the charm of the game.
What is this? Charm? Making stunts with dice-rolling adds charm to the game? How so? Well, if you like it, by all means, go ahead. However, this thread is supposed to prevent dice-rolling stunties from trying to get the upperhand and I can't see how a computer is supposed to remove some charm from the game.

It serves its purpose in any case.

EDIT: Alternatively, you could use a graphics calculator.
 
#20 ·
You could also use a pocket calculator, such as a Ti-83. It can be programmed to pick random numbers as well, ans is way more handy than a PC. However, it only works if your opponent trusts your programming.. none of my opponents does, at least not if I roll good.

I know that guys technique subconsciously, as I often use it to roll a ridiculous amounts of 1s. Last time I fired all of my starcannons at a space marine tac. squad, I scored 6 hits aaaaand; YATZHEE! All ones. And the worst thing is that it is not the first time it have happened to me lately.. the dice gods must me thisting for another sacrifice soon.
 
#24 ·
http://hamete.org/dserver/dice

Found this site on a google search for : virtual dice roll

Maybe insist that your games room should use a system that you can contest the dice roll. A computer...cold hard calculation and a service dedicated to fair dice rolls could save you from frustrating people. If he is so sure about his technique...let him try and beat the 'system'! Sportsmen will aprove.
 
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