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2000 Pt. Dark Eldar

1K views 14 replies 7 participants last post by  Lost Nemesis 
#1 ·
Before I post this list, I want to make sure everyone realizes - I will accept constructive criticism, NOT "this army suks" or anything. I made it without playing any games with DE, based on some things I've read in the forums and some assumptions I've made myself. Any constructive feedback is welcome from those of you who know these armies, but keep in mind that I'm not a guy who likes to venture the same path as everyone else. Thanks for reading this silly paragraph, and be warned - its a silly army list. ^_^

HQ
Archon
Tormentor Helm, Punisher, Shadow Field, Combat Drugs, Animus Vitae
150

Retinue
5x Incubi, 2x Warriors with Splinter Cannons
161

Transport
Raider w/ Dark Lance
55


Troops
Squad 1
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 2
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 3
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 4
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Splinter Cannons

Squad 5
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Splinter Cannons
580


Fast Attack
Jetbike Squad 1
3 Jetbikes
2 Jetbikes with Blasters

Jetbike Squad 2
3 Jetbikes
2 Jetbikes with Blasters
290


Elites
Wych Squad 2x
9 Wyches with Wych Weapons, Succubus with Agoniser and Wych Weapons
314

Transport
2x Raider w/ Dark Lance
110


Heavy Support
Ravager 1
3x Disintegrators
120

Ravager 2
3x Disintegrators
120

Talos
100

TOTAL: 2000 points.


Thanks for the boring read and I hope it is somewhat decent...useful feedback accepted of course. ^_^

EDIT: There has been yet another edit. I switched power weapons with Agonisers for my Wyches, I've lowered the Incubi down to 5 instead of 7, I lowered the SC warriors to a 12 man unit and took out their blasters, and I added a second 12 man SC squad.



 
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#2 ·
I like it

but one question do you plan the talos to get into CC? Its hard and usually only fort 2 turns max, versus a shooty army where you have to walk all the way across the board.

I dont know if this is a good idea, but I just thought of it...

On the ravager with all dark lances, make one a disintegrator, and take one off of a transport. I dont know if it will be good, or bad, but just something to think about. and for other players to think about also
 
#3 ·
maybe trim down the dark lance squads by a few arriors and make another squad of warriors, having 8 guys more than the minimum that wont be any good shooting could be better used as more than just extra casualties

also adding ina few blasters to your splintercannon squad is usually a good idea cause you can blast any close vehicles or cook heavy armor troops too, instakills most charactors as well

most people would say never add warriors into hq squads cause the casualties they will take will make your expensive unit fall back, but thats up too you

also the darklance ravager might not be a good idea, you should maybe add dark lances to all raiders and beef up the 2nd ravger with 3 disses instead, so you can always move fast enough to avoid damage and still unload on power armor troops and terms, then you can let the raiders deal with the enemy armor, that would give you 7 lances, and your jetbikes can do it to when they close

just a few ideas to think about
 
#4 ·
I would like you to take away drazhar.you can get 3 incubis for his points. ;)

I would like you got make 3x12 Warriors with 2 dark lances.

it gives you about the same amount of troops, but 2 dark lances more, and that is very nice to have ^_^

I use two ravagers in 1500 pts. one disntigator rav, and dark lance one. Just in case I need it and it has proven its worth ;)

/cheers :lol:
 
#5 ·
Thanks for all the replies. I'll take some of the ideas into mind. The main reason I have the Disintegrator with the HQ's Raider is simply for more covering fire than a Dark Lance. It'll be getting rather close to the enemy to drop my HQ off to fight, and I want it to do something. I'll think about taking Drazhar out, also, and I'll see about the squads of warriors as well. The main reason I have the Warriors in HQ is simple - 12 shots before a charge could hurt the squad I'm charging into. And they can also take hits for Incubi. (I think that under new rules it's the majority save that counts, isn't it? If so, I might be wrong, then I'll be using 3+ anyway.) I'll probably take Drazhar out, add one or two more Incubi to max the Revenue out to ten, and I'll see where it goes from there.

EDIT: Also, the Talos, even if it doesn't get into CC, it will take some heavy fire and that's mostly what I want. I'd rather them shoot at a big, evil looking thing that only costs 100 points than shoot at my 150 point Archon and Revenue in a Raider. If they neglect it, and it does get into CC, then that'll be their problem, won't it? :shifty: Sort of like the Eldar Avatar, it's like a scare factor and they'll either undercommit in destroying it or overcommit. Either way is a win for just 100 points.

EDIT2: Also, I have made some changes to the army list above. Please check it out. ^_^



 
#6 ·
HQ
Archon
Tormentor Helm, Punisher, Shadow Field, Combat Drugs, Animus Vitae
150

Retinue
7x Incubi, 2x Warriors with Splinter Cannons
204

Transport
Raider w/ Dark Lance
55
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Archon great. 2x warriors with splintercannons, great. Raider, great. Too many incubi. With this you will pulverise a squad on the charge, not good for you as you will then be shot to pieces, say take 3-5 incubi instead then you are likely to leave 1-2 of the enemy alive and with your higher WS and power armour they aren't going to hhurt you in all likelyhood, and if they do remove a warrior (Majority armour save is working in your favour here).....

Troops
Squad 1
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 2
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 3
10 Warriors
2 Warriors with Dark Lances

Squad 4
16 Warriors
2 Warriors with Blasters
2 Warriors with Splinter Cannons
518
[snapback]250811[/snapback]​
If you've dropped the incubi to 4 like I suggested then I would also suggest dropping 1 warrior from your SC squad and buying a second splintercannon squad with 10 men and 2 SC's

Fast Attack
Jetbike Squad 1
3 Jetbikes
2 Jetbikes with Blasters

Jetbike Squad 2
3 Jetbikes
2 Jetbikes with Blasters
290
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Jetbikes are cool, nough said.

Elites
Wych Squad 2x
9 Wyches with Wych Weapons, Succubus with Power Weapon and Wych Weapons
304

Transport
2x Raider w/ Dark Lance
110

[snapback]250811[/snapback]​
Hmm I'd want to give the succubi agonisers, they are a few more points, though. I would suggest gleaning such points by eitehr dropping to 3 incubi or dropping some warriors or the blasters on the SC squad, agonisers on a Wyche succubus will net more points than a blaster on a warrior.

Heavy Support
Ravager 1
3x Disintegrators
120

Ravager 2
3x Disintegrators
120

Talos
100
[snapback]250811[/snapback]​
Nice selection of heavy support. Use it carefully and all will be well.

TOTAL: 1978 points.

[snapback]250811[/snapback]​
[/quote]

Still got a few points spare, I've suggested places to spend them but its your list dude.

As always my suggestions are just my opinions.
 
#8 ·
Dude in your commentary you said 2 12 man SC squads, yet you wrote 2 10 man SC squads. Other than that everything looks cool. Remember your HQ is tooled to kill TROOPS not monsters. Don't send them against TMC's or Wraithlords, only T4 and less opponents where their bonuses will make it worth while. Use your wyches with agonisers and dark lances to take down the big nasties.
 
#9 ·
Originally posted by karantalsis@Nov 17 2004, 16:56
Dude in your commentary you said 2 12 man SC squads, yet you wrote 2 10 man SC squads.
[snapback]252117[/snapback]​
Haha, that's just the structure confusing you. Guess I should have specified. It's listed as "10 Warriors" then below it "2 Warriors with Splinter Cannons." I have it so that I mean in the single squad there are 10 normal warriors PLUS 2 with SC. Sorry about that! Thanks for the advice. Now I just need to buy it. Brand new its about $700...not something to be happy about. Ebay, here I come.



 
#10 ·
well if u dont expect the talos to get int CC then jst wlk it 4ward wit the knowledge tht it will die n let it soak up firepower, as its T7 so wont b instant deathed by out, and if ppl chose to fire at summit tht moves 6" instead of a ravager which got sum nasty firepower tht can hurt em quicker thn the talos then ther stupid.

against shootin armies use a talos as a distraction, unless they got sum assaulty troops in ther

other thn tht nice army
 
#12 ·
OK dude, no offence now, but I'd have to say it's a bad list. I know you said you wanted to make an atypical list and not follow the rest of the crowd, that's cool, but you'll have problems winning with this army here. You've done a lot right especially considering you've never played DE yet, but there are some flaws, one of which I think you'll find is a rather major one.

No point beating about the bush - the major flaw is that you only have three Raiders that start the battle on the board, and in those Raiders you have expensive assault squads. The unfortunate truth is that these Raiders aren't going to last five minutes. Most players treat Raiders as a priority target when facing Dark Eldar and concentrate a lot of fire on them. Raiders are very lightly armoured and can't stand up to enemy fire. Most opposing armies will have little trouble downing two or all of your Raiders before they can get close enough to dump off their passengers. What with the rules for a transport being shot down at high speed and the Entanglement rule, the squads inside downed Raiders are pulped, as good as out of the game. I'd say you'd be lucky to get even one of your assault units into close-combat unless playing in very favourable terrain or a favourable scenario. Not a good way to use over 1/3 of your points.

The Jetbike squads are very small and won't stand up to enemy firepower. If either takes a single casualty they have to take a Fall Back test. If they take two casualties, if they Fall Back they can't rally. I'd amalgamate the two squads into a single one, or make cuts elsewhere to get the points to beef them up to 5 models each.

Wyches - the Succubus is best armed with an Agonizer. It's only 5pts more expensive than a Power Weapon but it's sooo much better!


I'd say the underlying problem is that your army is trying to be two things at once - you have a strong footslogging firebase with the Warriors, but you want speedy Raider-borne assault troops as well. In 4th ed, for maximum effectiveness you really need to concentrate on being one or the other.

If you decide you want an atypical army with a strong shooty Warrior complement and fast assault troops, the way to do it is to use lots of Reavers and tooled-up characters on Reavers as your fast assault element. It's a lot harder for the opponent to prevent large numbers Reavers from getting into assaults due to their quantity and their Invulnerable saves when turbo-boosting. A couple of 'sacrificial' min-sized Grotesque squads in Raiders can be used to draw fire away from them too (the secrecy rules mean the opponent won't know what's in these Raiders - for all he knows they are filled with Incubi and Wyches, not a mere 3 Grotesques... ;) ).

If you really really want a fast Raider assault army though, you'll have to invest in lots of Raider Squads. You need 'decoys' to distract enemy fire away from the more valuable Wych and Incubi Raiders, the basic 5-man Raider Squad with a Splinter Cannon and Blaster is the best 'decoy' to use for this.
 
#13 ·
I apologize, since this is the second time my army list structure has confused people. :hmm: I do have 5 Jetbikes in each squad, I just put it so that there are three normal ones and two ones with blasters. Sorry about that! I had already changed the Succubi so that they had Agonisers, and I see exactly where you're coming from with the Raiders being shot down. What do you think I should take out so I may put in a "decoy" Raider squad, preferably two? Thanks for the comments, they are appreciated. ^_^



 
#14 ·
Originally posted by Lost Nemesis@Nov 21 2004, 04:22
What do you think I should take out so I may put in a "decoy" Raider squad, preferably two?
Hmm, well here's the problem. In 4th edition, assault units in Raiders were nerfed considerably. The opponent can target any Raider he wants because Raiders don't block LOS any more. So, if you only have 2 'decoys' there is still a 3/5 chance of the enemy picking to shoot at one of the valuable Raiders. You really need a lot of 'decoy' Raider Squads to stand a good chance of getting your good assault units into close combat. To get that, you'd have to change your army concept considerably, even as much as replacing all the Warrior Squads with Raider Squads. I just don't think it's possible to create a strong Raider assault and have the powerful Warrior firebase in an effective 4th edition 2000pt army. So I'd think about concentrating on one or the other.

My advice, if you want to keep the overall 'feel' of the army, would be to go for the Reavers as your fast assaulters instead of units in Raiders. That's a pretty unorthodox army too, I'm sure you'll be pleased to note. ;)

Here's a quick concept 2000pt army list of what I mean (total number of models in unit in brackets):

HQ
Archon - Reaver Jetbike, Agonizer, Tormentor Helm, Shadow Field, Combat Drugs, Archangel of Pain, Gruesome Talisman

Haemonculi (3) - Reaver Jetbike, Scissorhand, Destructor

Troops

Warriors (10) - 2 Dark Lances

Warriors (10) - 2 Dark Lances

Warriors (10) - 2 Dark Lances

Warriors (10) - 2 Dark Lances

Warriors (10) - 2 Splinter Cannons, 2 Blasters

Warriors (10) - 2 Splinter Cannons, 2 Blasters

Fast Attack

Reaver Jetbikes (6) - 2 Blasters, Succubus with Agonizer and Tormentor Helm

Reaver Jetbikes (6) - 2 Blasters, Succubus with Agonizer and Tormentor Helm

Reaver Jetbikes (6) - 2 Blasters, Succubus with Agonizer and Tormentor Helm

Heavy Support

Ravager - 2 Disintegrators, 1 Dark Lance

Ravager - 2 Disintegrators, 1 Dark Lance

Talos

Note#1: Some people hate mixing weapons on Ravagers. In 3rd edition it was a bad idea, but in 4th the new template rules means it doesn't make a lot of difference and gives a little extra flexibility

Note#2: The Talos is slow as hell, but can give you some good close assault support for the Warriors. You may want to drop it for a decoy '3 Grotesques in a Raider' unit to draw fire away from the Reavers. Either are decent choices, it largely depends what kind of army you're facing. Vs shooty, the decoy is better, vs balanced or assault-heavy then I'd pick the Talos.
 
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