Cows, with holes in their sides - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    Karrot Dialysis karantalsis's Avatar
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    Cows, with holes in their sides

    Where I work we have cows. They have holes in their sides. These holes are filled with hollow rubber bungs through which it is possible to feel the cows innards.

    The purpose of this is research ont he cows, that research requires regular tactile inspection of the cows ovaries and the bungs thing was decided on as more humane than regular open surgery. Obviously this has been through alot of ethics commitees.

    Many non-reasearcher people I have met who have seen or heard of the cows are horrified at the idea however so I thought I'd ask what you think of it, as you are a pretty diverse bunch. As far as modern science can tell the bungs don't hurt the cows or have any effect on their behaviour at all, so, discuss.


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  3. #2
    ISIS Secret Agent Squishy mpdscott's Avatar
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    I don't see what the issue is. Okay so they've got holes in them. The holes aren't constantly bleeding are they? It's just a fact of research that sometimes unusual situation arise when it comes to collecting and analysing data.

    As things stand, there are tribes in Africa who regularly bleed their cows and mix the blood with milk as a drink. Cows are fairly large mammals, with a decent blood supply, so taking a cup here and a cup there isn't going to cause the animal any problems.

    It's essentially the same with the "holy" cows.

    In fact, it is not unheard of (but not frequent) for a person to leave surgery with an open incision. Sometimes it's necessary for the correct healing of the body. I remember seeing a story on TV just recently where a man had a space ,larger than a basketball, in his abdomen that was left open, because the wound had to be cleaned every day. Admittedly it was not your standard situation, his abdomen had become infected with a highly resistant bacteria that had turned his intestines to liquid, and chlorine was the only thing that would kill it; but it's the same principle, the body has incredibly powers of recouperation and adaption.

    "That which doesn't kill you only makes you stronger" (or leaves you maimed and unable to function)
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  4. #3
    for good and for awesome! kore's Avatar
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    I've never heard of this and I have to say...that sounds awesome!! Post some pics.
    Karmoon: "well.. any kore = good kore" 12:35pm PST 23 May 2007


  5. #4
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    Well, Iím familiar with the concept of cannulated cows, which are cows with an artificial opening in their sides leading to the largest of their four stomachs. Originally the cannulas were used to extract samples of the cowsí stomach content for research on livestock nutrition and health care, but now many farmers actually keep cannulated cows to serve as donors of stomach bacteria necessary for proper digestion to sick cows whose own bacteria have been killed by treatment with antibiotics.

    Cannulated cows are as healthy as other cows, their cannula being kept free of infection by the naturally occurring micro-organisms in their digestive system, and they seem to suffer no pain or discomfort from the cannula. I have seen a cannulated cow myself with a little window instead of a plug allowing veterinarians to inspect the stomach content without even touching the cow.

    As for the procedures youíre performing on your cows, I expect them to be a little more extensive and invasive since youíre making an unnatural opening from the infectious outside to the sterile insides of the cowsí body, as opposed to the cannulated stomach which is already connected to the outside through the GI-tract. Even so, this is no more unusual than an open incision performed on humans, as mentioned by Mpdscott, and itís certainly safer and more humane than putting the cows repeatedly through anaesthesia, major surgery, and forced healing afterwards. If itís for research purposes and has passed the inspection of the ethical committees, then I donít see a problem with it at all.

    For Kore, here are some pictures of a cannulated cow:





    Interesting stuff, Karantalsis!

    ~Greph.
    "Girls are nice and cuddly on the outside, and freaky on the inside." ~ Lost Nemesis.


  6. #5
    Mr Commisar to you Commisarlestat's Avatar
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    This is fascinating! Do you think this comes under animal testing? The second picture is a little grim. Do you think they would ever consider using this on other animals or even humans?

    A

  7. #6
    Advocatus Diaboli Rork's Avatar
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    That's one badass hole (I was expecting something on the small side, more fool me).

    Any sort of test on animals has to go through so many different checks these days it's near impossible to find an "unjustifiable" experiment.

    I don't see a big issue with it...I hadn't even heard of it until this thread.


    Having an army and not owning a rulebook is like owning a car with no steering wheel.

    Quote Originally Posted by amishcellphone
    <3 rork. He does all the arguing so I don't have to.

  8. #7
    Karrot Dialysis karantalsis's Avatar
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    Not working on them myself, just know some people who are I work on microbes personally, pretty red microbes from teh dead sea . Yeah those are very similar in appearence and concept to what I'm talking about greph, some difference, but not enough to warrant a speerate pic or me finding my camera .

    Well if someone else who thinks its a bad thing posts this might be more interesteing, but I'm glad to see so many people with what I consider a sensible view of things. The reason I posted in the first place though is cuase I am not too sure waht non scientists think so thanks .

    @Commisarleastat other animals, sure if there was a reason to, humans, probably not, but hten medics might come up with a use for it, I woudln't know, not a medic .

  9. #8
    0!=1jumpin'punch'swing jONESIE's Avatar
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    Like Rork, I have never seen this before either.

    Needless to say, If i ever do more spawn for my chaos, it will be based off that second picture there:x haha

    But very interesting
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaffar_Hasad
    You need more Mordians?
    They still exist?
    LO RULES

  10. #9
    The Allmighty Chaos Boots Process's Avatar
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    In short.... EEeeew :x

    As long as it doesn't hurt the cow (and she doesn't seem all taht uncomfortable) and I don't ever have to see it again, its fine by me. now I'm going to be sick...
    What is Aurora Prime?
    "behold, I am the flamer, the searing one, the combustion of all spontanious flash fires, I am process" BIG RED BUTTON!

  11. #10
    Karrot Dialysis karantalsis's Avatar
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    Other cool things:

    Featherless chickens for hot climates

    Glow in the dark mice

    Rabbits with glow in the dark livers .

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