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One of my friends recently decided not to collect Ogres because of their current state of weakness, and there's ONE person at my local GW who plays them and I've yet to see him win. The army seems to be in a dire state, and I've been wondering: What do Ogres need in their next book to become competetive? My first thoughts have been 1) Better Leadership 2) More protection against shooting, 3) Better Weapon Skill and 4) A new dimension to their play style. The last is obviously the hardest to implement, but whenever I see Ogres at work, they seem to panic from shooting/magic and when they actually reach combat they tend to miss a lot, and they also seem to be very predictable. I don't actually have experience playing them, but they're just my initial thoughts!
I think a few magic items could sort most of those out. For example, make the Rune Maw apply also against shooting.
But personally, I think we're alright as it is. Though I think a new playing option would be a good idea, like how the Dwarfs were given the option to move in their latest book.
I agree, the army list is pretty much where it needs to be. But, I think, as a whole, all of the ogre units should be roughly 5-10 points cheaper. My reasoning on this is Fear. In 6th edition, fear was alot deadlier than it is now. If you charged a unit and they failed their fear test, they ran away, no questions asked. In 7th edition, if the unit is larger than yours, and when isn't it, they still stay where they are. Also, Bulls should be a more viable option. I never field more than the one bare minimum unit of Bulls that I'm required to take. As it is, they're not worth their points. I could see them being worth their current points value if they came with an ironfist and light armor standard. Then they'd have a 4+ save in close combat and they'd be a better choice as they'd have some more survivability. This isn't necessary, but, it'd be nice if ironfists could be used as shields against shooting as well. That's where we really need the extra points of armor. Those are some of the ideas that we've thrown together with the guys I play with.
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It isn't that Ogres are bad, but a lot of armies have gotten a lot better. An orc isn't that much worse than a bull ogre at all, and you can get around 7-8 orcs for each ogre.
Ogres really need an edge in close combat. Despite the fluff, most of my victories have been a result of their impressive speed, massed great weapons, effective bull charges, and creative use of leadbelchers and gorgers. Oddly enough, charging head on into close combat is actually a horrible idea for ogres, considering that the opponent's rank bonus gives them a 2-3 point head start before the fight even begins. Ogres have to pick their battles carefully, avoid large blocks of troops, and hit the opponents with several units at once.
Ogres work better if you think of them as calvary, rather than blocks of troops. Maneuver them around, hit the enemy from multiple sides at once, and pick on their most vulnerable units. Charging head on into a block of 30 Orcs is suicide, but not if you use a bangstick, leadbelchers, and Bonecrusher to soften them up first.
Ogres really need three things to be effective: a true cavalry unit (Rinox Riders in the book would be nice), stubborn (or a similar close combat advantage), and a point reduction (especially for bulls).
Last edited by mynameisgrax; January 5th, 2009 at 03:41. Reason: forgot one thing
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Well i think they would have to give them something like a bit more terror or at least a gut maw ability as a optional purchase. I mean they do eat their opponents, it would be fair to get something from them. And one more thing, maximum S is lower than that of "smaller" races. I think that almost-large-target-monstrous-creature should get a bit more S