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Thread: O.K vs T.K

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    O.K vs T.K

    Ive been playing ogres for a little while now...still very new to it, but im getting more comfortable, yet ive only ever come close to beating a skaven army. When I play against my usual opponent (T.K) I get spanked pretty hard.
    Although the last game im sure i would have won had the dice been in my favor the last 2 rounds, but I digress.

    Id like some tried and true strageys to womp on him hard and fast.
    we usually play 2k lists.


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    Junior Member Domoto's Avatar
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    Well hello, Always nice to hear someone is sticking with OK even through the difficulty that comes with them. Well I haven't really had all that much experience against TK with OK but I have played against VC a good amount and yes they are different but the same ITP Block units apply. You will definitely want at least 2 butchers not so much to fit the standard OK cookie cutter list but because to TK the magic phase is basically a make or break. He will have a good amount of magic so you wont be able to shut it down completely but if you can stop some here and there it will really help. Hitting him head on will not be the best of ideas, flanking with multiple units will be a huge to go for thing. try to bait and flee with bulls and flank with Ironguts as much as possible. If you can get it off Bonecruncher his Liche Priest (a good TK player will never let his LP in sight but sometimes it happens). The SSC can be a problem due to causing a Panic Check but keep moving around the table, never stand still if he takes one. If you can try and take out his more expensive units without sacraficing yours and avoid big block units unless you throw A LOT of guys at it. the main thing is to take out his units in 1-2 rounds of combat so that raising isnt even an option. Im not so sure Leadbelchers would be a great choice unless you fire at Ushabti and hope for the best or something like that since he can jsut raise wounds back. A tyrant with the tenderiser with be a chariot squads nightmare *grin*. Other than that im not sure what to tell you, maybe someone else has some better idea, but for me thats all ive really got, Good luck.
    "Far to the east of the old world within the craggy valleys and cave networks of the Mountains of Mourn, lie the Ogre Kingdoms."

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    hey thanks for the tips.
    Im still learning about this bait and flee tactic, think you could elaborate on it?

    also, i usually play with two butchers, but im considering three, just to help take his magic down a notch.
    as far as lead belchers go, ive had a good amount of success with them. I took out and entire unit of chariots in a Stand and shoot battle. its was pretty awesome to see the look on his face after that one.

    I usually play with a scrap launcher also, if i were better at guessing distances it would be of more use, but im getting there. its been of moderate use though.

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    Junior Member Domoto's Avatar
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    Ah I see, well leadbelchers CAN be effective, I usually run 2 units of 2 just because, but taking out a unit of chariots must have been awesome, and yes I can only imagine the opponents face was priceless. As far as the bait and flee goes, well the basic way I use it for example is say there is a unit of ushabti, what you do is take a unit of bulls (naked which is how I usually run them) and put them to where there are far enough for both yourself and the enemy to charge eachother, basically force him to charge you since if he doesnt you will charge him, he charges, you flee and while this happens have a unit of ironguts ready to make a flank charge against that unit of ushabti so you baited him into charging you fled so as to hopefully outrun and not lose your guys then flank him since he moved forward due to a hopeful failed charge, thats a basic example of bait anf flee, and the thing is even if he doesnt charge you just charge him anyway since even a unit of bulls CAN do some damage, granted against ushabti not so sure but I was jsut using them as an example, and as for the scraplaucnher I never really liked it, it can be fun sure, but for me, I never use it. Hope I helped, and as far as bait anf flee goes it takes time to learn when and how to use it, experience is the key, but good luck, and I try and look for any other questions you post and give my help, in fact if you would like jsut Private message me and I will help any way I can. Now go eat those sand filled skeletons in the name of the great maw!
    "Far to the east of the old world within the craggy valleys and cave networks of the Mountains of Mourn, lie the Ogre Kingdoms."

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    Senior Member bagotrx's Avatar
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    I reckon bait and flee works best if you have fast cav, which unfortunately the ogres don't have. I checked my Tomb King rules, and the only unit that can outcharge your ogres are his chariots. Heavy horsemen can outcharge you as well, but I'm only talking about units that will hurt. Honestly, a unit of heavy horsemen can charge you and will cause about 2 wounds. You'll strike back and crumble them pretty easily. Watch out for the chariots. A tyrant with a great weapon or something that gives him strength 7 will carve through chariots. Bone giants are a pain but you just need to combo charge it. 2 units, 1 into the flank and 1 into the front will smash that thing apart, but one of them will have to be a unit of Ironguts for it to really work well.

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    As a TK player, one thing that often gets me into trouble is when my ogre opponent plays an 'MSU' style list. This isually means he has many more units on the field than I do, which allows him to set up multiple charges per unit of mine. One thing to watch out for though is shooting, as 25% casualties will cause a panic test.

    Str. 7 as others have mentioned will work wonders, which is quite easy to do with ogres

    When my oponent brings that scraplauncher i generally just ignore it. Most of the time it scatters away. When it wounds, i can heal them back. As long as it doesn't kb my heiro But if it works for you, then stick with it as it has potential.

    I've also found leadbeltchers to be very little of a threat. The first time I played Ogres they worked great, as they can stand and shoot which I didn't know. But now I normal move my chariots to within half their charge range, and magic charge them == no stand and shoot. This is where your butchers and a dispel scroll will be GREAT. Watch for this. Those pesky chariots will be torn apart.

    So as the users above me have said....try using an MSU style list to set up multiple charges (bait and flee when needed...but yeah the only thing I have that can out-charge you are chariots). Lots of Str. 7, and watch for the chariots creeping really close without charging to negate stand and shoot.

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    Please expand a little on what kind of list your opponent usually runs.

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    Thanks for all the help, but what is a MSU list?

    my opponent usually runs something along the lines of:

    1 unit of archers. (which never do any thing)

    1 unit of spear men

    casket of souls

    herophant

    3 lich preists

    tomb prince

    screaming skull catapult.

    and 2 or 3 units of chariots, maybe 4 in each unit.
    ----

    I played him on sunday, and gave one of my butchers Hell Heart. Didnt really help out a whole lot, but the little bit it did do, was pretty awesome. so that will def. be a repeat item

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    Senior Member bagotrx's Avatar
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    MSU means multiple small units. Units of 4 Ironguts and a lot of units of 3-4 Bulls. It means you can combo charge and have a much easier chance of crumbling his units.

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    How did the hellheart do anything against Tomb Kings? They can't miscast....

    I've found It Came From Below stuff to be a bit annoying. Swarms and Scorpions will mess up a few good charges, though don't overestimate them - at best they'll kill one ogre. Most ogres should be able to slap it back into nothing, even with swarms.

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