Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
Unlike many people, I've actually experienced quite a bit of success with the Ogres. When used like calvary, rather than normal rank and file troops, Ogres can overwhelm and crush opponents with wave after wave of attacks, more often then not, directly at the enemy's flanks, denying your opponent their prized rank bonus, and giving your Ogres a glorious victory...
Except against Vampire Counts.
I'm not speaking about the power of their lords, their fearlessness (although this does make your ability to cause fear useless in regards to panicking others), or even their powerful attack spells.
No, I'm speaking about 'raise dead'. As a speed and maneuverability focused army, with no flyers, no fast calvary, and very few shooters, the Vampire Counts have a simple strategy that seems to render an Ogre army all but useless:
Use the spell raise dead to create zombies directly in the way of the Ogres. Then use Invocation of Nehek to add more zombies to said unit. Then use Vanhels Danse Macabre to push those zombies directly into close combat with your Ogres. Despite the fact that the zombies have no chance of winning, the Vampires can simply repeat this strategy every turn, until his powerful units get into position and then flank and destroy yours.
Without the ability to take a powerful caster in most games (since you have to take a Tyrant in order to take a Slaughtermaster, you can't use Slaughtermasters in normal sized games), there's simply to way to keep a Vampire Counts opponent from casting raise dead at least once on his turn, and once is all he needs to completely screw up your strategy.
Plus, despite the Ogre's relatively large number of attacks, a zombie unit can quickly become a neverending tarpit if your opponent keeps adding zombies into it with Invocation of Nehek, and all the more so if he keeps creating more units every turn, creating a neverending line of tarpits, to prevent you from ever successfully reaching him.
Vampire Counts are easily the most overpowered Warhammer Army, and with this simple, and cheap strategy, they've seemed to render my poor Ogres all but powerless.
Has anyone else had more success against them? Is there a strategy/tactic I'm missing that can keep him from tying up or blocking my Ogres?
Last edited by mynameisgrax; May 16th, 2009 at 15:20.
Yeah, that strategy really is a painful one. They have a ton of PD to get IoN and Raise Dead off on one die each, so I wouldn't bother stopping those (the one die casting thing does get risky though, remember the 3+ rule?). But typically, Vanhel's will always be cast on two-three dice. Personally, I would start thinking about Butcher spam. As well as being able to soak up the enemy magic, they can actually kill stuff too. How many points do you play?
Otherwise, that is indeed a horrible plan which is very hard for us to counter, as our magic defence sucks, and increased MR doesn't do a thing. What you could consider is buying a few units of DoW cavalry and try beating them at their own game (shove them out the front, and hope they get charged in the magic phase - flee them, which should open up your units). Barring that, all I can do about that one myself is just charge in and hope I roll high enough to hit the main unit in hte overrun.
DoW Calvary? I'm afraid I'm not sure what that is. The only calvary I'm aware of in the Ogre army are the Rinox Riders, and they're a pain to get into an army, since they take up a special and a rare slot for each unit.
I usually play 2000 points, which isn't enough to get a second lord. I can try 3 butchers, as they've always proven useful. The magic resistance has proven effective against more aggressive magic using armies (magic missiles, blasts and such) such as the Lizard Men and Goblin armies, but as you said, it doesn't help against the summoning Vampire Counts.
Thanks for the suggestions!
I have never faced a raising army before but I have faced the deathstar bloodknight unit with uber items/banners and lord.
I never seem to get a good lure on those knights and if i do the unit just crushes 3 ironguts in the flank and 3 in the front with a tooled up tyrant.
I'm not sure how to handle both ways.
I was more thinking of the extra dispel dice that you'll get. A MR3 unit would be as useless as an anorexic ogre, but more dice and scrolls will help a fair amount.I usually play 2000 points, which isn't enough to get a second lord. I can try 3 butchers, as they've always proven useful. The magic resistance has proven effective against more aggressive magic using armies (magic missiles, blasts and such) such as the Lizard Men and Goblin armies, but as you said, it doesn't help against the summoning Vampire Counts.!
what about running a skrag list with lots of gorgers? It's a little cheesy, but then your opponent will have to fight on all sides rather than just in front of him. You'd have your main force coming from in front of him and have 4+ gorgers harrasing him from behind.
Skrag counts as an army general, so you won't need those points for a tyrant, and if ranks of zombies pop up in front of him, then who cares? What better way to unleash the special "blessings of the great maw" that he and the gorgers get when he kills enemy units..
Like I said, it's cheesy, but you could take skrag and fill the rest of your hero slots with butchers... that should be enough dispel dice + dispel scrolls to hold up the VC magic for a while.
Last edited by thegoss84; May 18th, 2009 at 23:56.
You could try the Hellheart.
My experience has been that once you use it, your opponent will suddenly be much more cautious about casting spells, limiting himself to 1 PD spells, or maybe 2, for a turn. That'll buy you a turn to smash things...