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I'm putting an orc big boss in a chariot, but I need some help:
1. which subspecies? normal, black, or savage?
2. which upgrades and weapons?
3. which magic gear?
also, I'm going to have my general on foot with a great, big, converted, killy axe, and need the same questions answered.
Thanks in advance, and hope this isn't a bother to you guys
All three are pretty good, but they have different things they excel at. If you want to get a jump on the opponent, black orc on chariot is good. He can take heavy armor, which gives you a little more resistance in combat. The waaagh move is really good to get that extra move before you charge, and it's especially good against enemies that charge 14'' or more. Simply call the waaagh, move D6, and charge 14'' and thump some bretonnian knights that were waiting outside your charge range. Advice: run him with shield, magic weapon, and heavy armor. Martog's basha or the sword of might are good. Maybe even the Screamin' Sword or akkrit axe if you're not using them on the warboss and want your chariot boss to do some heavier damage.
The savage orc version is my favorite. It doubles the chariot's attacks and makes it a unit able to break the enemy on the charge by itself. However, you really have to watch out being baited with the chariot, as people will try and lure you into obstacles to kill the chariot. Advice: drive the chariot BACKWARDS. You can end your move with a chariot however you want every turn, so end it with the chariot facing backwards so you don't get frenzy baited. Only turn it around when you feel like you have a good charge coming up. Equipment: As little as possible, usually. You want it cheap, in case something goes wrong and he runs into some trees. Sword of might or spear, light armor, shield, and that's it. Don't spend too much on him. You can afford to throw some more expensive stuff on the black orc, as his armor is a little better and can generally get the charge on most opponents. Not so much with this one.
The regular orc is usually good for a bargain basement chariot when you're strained for special slots. You can generally give him crap equipment and just use him as a regular chariot. Equipment: spear, shield, light armor, nothing else. However, for the points, the goblin chariot with a cheap hero is a much better buy for the points and nearly as effective. A goblin hero on a chariot with a spear, armor, and shield, costs just around 100 points, much cheaper than the cheapest orc boss.
Ditto all that advice about chariots.
Also, very amused and impressed by the idea of driving the chariots backwards. A masterstroke. Logic being that if you can't see it you can't charge it right?\
Can't be right surely?
It is superb though - being dragged into the bushes can be very painful!
Thanks for the help, Sephiroth. I'll probably be taking a savage orc with the best basha, though, a black orc with porko's pigstikka is tempting too...
Genius advice about driving a savage chariot backwards though. What you cant see cant make you bonkers! also, If someone's on a chariot (any orc) Do they get the thick skinned rule? because having a double mounted save would be real nice.
P.S. Any advice for the black orc warboss?
You don't get the thick-skinned rule on a chariot, but you get +2 armour anyway, so it's the same.
You can also either use the chariots armour or your own whichever is best. So if you don't give a savage orc character a shield, he'll have a 4+ save anyway
cool! So I don't even have to spend the points on a savage boss to get him a halfway decent save! Or would the shield compound onto the chariot's save?
Learned it from watching a Khorne player in a tournament. It was a nasty surprise.Genius advice about driving a savage chariot backwards though. What you cant see cant make you bonkers!Depends on what you want to do with the list. The regular orc lists run several different ways. The first is to make him a combat beatstick. The second is to make him a solid general who grants leadership to the troops. They aren't always mutually exclusive. If you're running him on foot, your biggest problem will be his initiative and his armor save. Since we lost Drog's Armor to the new 7th edition rulebook, running a warboss on foot is a little more risky. If you're running him to be killy, I always like magic weapons. You CAN do pretty well with just the Armed to Da Teef rule that they come with, but orc magic weapons are some of the cheapest in the game. Always take the enchanted shield on this guy, as the +1 will do you good. I would run enchanted shield, heavy armor, the akkrit axe (cheap and reliable), and the best boss 'at. The killing blow works well with the akkrit axe, so I might take that with the last of the points.P.S. Any advice for the black orc warboss?
As for tactics, orcs squabble. He needs to be quelling it. Dump him in a unit of 25-30 orcs and let him kill stuff and let the rank and file provide static combat resolution with shields, standard, and musician.The chariot gives its armor save or +2 armor save, whichever is best, to your orc against SHOOTING, not combat. Page 64 in rulebook. In close combat, they fight in the exact same way as characters riding monsters. That means your opponent can pick them out and they don't get the chariot save in combat. But the shield stacks with shooting, so a black orc with a shield on a chariot should get a 2+ save against shots. In combat, it goes to a 4+. As far as taking the shield, it's too cheap not to take, as it stacks against shooting and provides protection in combat when your chariot save bonus goes away.You can also either use the chariots armour or your own whichever is best. So if you don't give a savage orc character a shield, he'll have a 4+ save anyway
Last edited by sephiroth87; December 14th, 2008 at 18:06.
Good stuff and can only echo it. Especially the shields part as odds are they will return you 1 wound (at least) most battles.
What sort of tournament did you see the backwards chariot being used? Were there and tutting GW personnel around or judging?
I've always preferred gobbo chariots in the past as the long movement combined with the "turn-on-a-sixpence" direction rules make them particularly good at picking up quarters or knocking off stragglers at the end of a game. (They don't tend to bounce off formed-up close combat units in my experience!)
The other advantage was that you could take 2 gob chariots for one slot in the past. Who else is stuck with spare chariots?
It was a local RTT where I live in Tennessee. I tried arguing it, then realized just how good it was and simply shook the guy's hand for the idea. I never called a judge over, simply because it's within the rules and I just wasn't prepared for it.
On the wolf chariots, I agree. They're simply better for the points with a character in it. And many people don't realize that even the humble goblin hero on a chariot is still Unit Strength 5, able to break ranks and claim quarters. And he has a heck of a charge. I have two wolf chariots that I just converted to have a hero and a shaman riding them.
But I have a whole orc and goblin chariot/cavalry army, though, so I don't mind having extras. Warboss on Wyvern, 3 characters riding chariots, 3 units of wolves, Savage orc boars, 3 boar chariots, 2 pump wagons, and giant. Every time I play it it gets cannonballed, but they're the best and most fun of the games I play.
right, so it would be a good idea to give a black orc warboss the best boss 'at, the akkrit axe, and the iron gnashas, along with heavy armor and a sheild, and a good sized orc unit for a general?
Also, does the WYSIWYG representation of the akkrit axe have to be a certain size, or can I make a gigantic, killy, two-handed axe with the sheild on his back?