Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
Doom diver is good with other artillery. Pump wagons are good for chariot heavy lists. Giants are good terror bombs and are fun but die easily. Trolls are cheap to "fill a slot" but naff.
To a NG horde? Assuming you have no war machines, stick some squigs pulling a pump wagon and have a laugh! That or a giant.
http://www.armyroster.com Check out my ToP WIP in the projects section!
Why does no-one appreciate the goodness of Trolls? They soak up wounds sooo well and they can hit back against everything. Their Vomit can slaughter heavy cavalry, and their Stupidity is not really a problem if they are charging to redirect a hard-hitting unit and/or are in combat.
So, as you can probably guess, my choice is Trolls.
Armies: (Chaos) Space Marines [1250pts], O&G [2250 pts], OK [1000pts]
Da face of Mork looks down on the Gobbers of da Bwoo Moon, da bestest Gobbos eva.
Because Trolls are *terrible*. Sorry you like them so much but if you're not running a warboss on a wyvern then space within that 12inch bubble of leadership is pretty valuable. They can't take down a ranked unit to the front, and are overpriced flankers basically. A 85 point unit of 10 boys with Champ and 2 choppas will do just as much damage on the charge. Yes regen is nice, if you're playing anywhere competitive then they're just going to be mauled by flaming attacks/redirected out of your leadership bubble/something else that makes them way too much of a pain in the ass to really care about.
In terms of the *best* rare choice, I think its a Giant. Stubborn leadership 10 is amazing, also doesnt suffer animosity and can do some nasty stuff in close combat. I think in a NG horde though a Doom Diver would be a better choice. The giant dies really fast when its the only thing to direct cannons/bolt throwers at. Doom Divers can also put a hurt on heavy cav.
Pump wagons are neat, but 2d6 movement isn't as cool as you might think, and 2d6 impact hits really sucks when you roll low. The only saving grace is the 2 for 1 slot, so if you're going to take 1, take 2.
Trolls aren't good in an all Night Goblin horde, as the highest leadership as 7 and thats not reliable when you are testing for stupidity every turn. What is fun is using 10 and having Gorbad as your lord.
But for all NG hordes, use either a giant or pump wagons.
In the future, you should ask this as a "In General Purposes, what O&G RARE is best?".
because O&G Rares largely depend on whom you are going up against.
Vs a Strong Magic opponent, you want Stone Trolls.
Vs a strong war-machine army, you probably want standard trolls or the doom diver
vs a slower army where you are going to get the charge, you want a Giant.
There are many variations.
Tailoring lists to specific opponents is lame, your list should be able to well against anyone you play. Not these are stone trolls against high elves, river/regular trolls against dwarves, oh a giant against VC, ect. Giants are also just as fast as trolls and more maneuverable with a smaller base and single model. I'll say it again, in an all goblin list Trolls are just not viable. With Skarsnik maybe, Gorbad sure, right up until he takes a wound and his leadership is reduced to a 6'' radius. Have a black orc on a wyvern? No good. On a boar? Well +2 AS is nice, but forget about his movement now cause he has to keep around the trolls. Also what happens after they do break the first thing they charge? The overrun 2d6 away, roll to high or have a person that actually played smart and positioned his unit to flee into an open area and you might as well removed them from the table they probably wont come back.
Yes, you can dedicate a character to them for an 7/8/9 leadership. Then you're paying 150 extra points to deal with a stupid unit, that still fails more often than animosity on anything less than a 10 leadership.
Seems a bunch of people really enjoy them though so I'll be done putting them down now. They are very easily the worst choice rare for O+G though.
Double doom divers is the best choice for points in my opinion.
Giant is ok, but for me its just and overpriced t5 pin cushion.
I like all three rare choices (sorry mikel2495) :p
I want to add the pump wagons are insane against toughness 3 armies and utter useless against T4.
Doomdivers piss off my opponent because they seem to hit every time!! (everytime they dont misfire)
Warchief Diggah o da Bloodmoon Squiggahs
To be fair all the rare choices we have in O&G (imho) serve different purposes and which choice you take depends largely on your army and style of play.
How about we do a pro's and con's list of each choice to weigh up what they may do? Feel free to correct me or add to these as I'm only human and prone to oversights
Tough (Regen and multiple wounds)
Ability to auto hit ignoring armour saves
Stupidity (definitely belongs at the top of the list as it is a big weakness)
The variants of trolls seem to provide extra protection at the sacrifice of more points per model.
Stubborn on high Ld
Strong Combat abilities
Tough against small fire
Prone to warmachine fire
Random combat abilities (Could also be a pro)
DOOM DIVER CATAPULT
Classy (Has to be said)
Ignores armour saves
Cheap for its effectiveness
Low Ld (for panic tests and such)
Prone to self destruction (as is any warmachine)
SNOTLING PUMP WAGON
Available in multiples
Random movement (Psychological impact on the enemy)
Ability to totally lawn mow over units
Immune to Psychology
Low Ld (though it is stubborn lol)
So I guess whichever choices you field just be aware of their strengths and weaknesses and work proactively to cover them
Dan the Man
Last edited by dantheman; August 12th, 2009 at 14:50.