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  1. #1
    Member Sybaris Slaay's Avatar
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    Elfs in Mordheim

    My friends and I play mostly elfs (dark elf, wood elf, high elf) and some lizards and goblins too. After looking at the rules it appears that these are 'unnoficial' or illegal lists - this game really appeals to us but frankly we have little to no interest in most of the 'official' warbands - they do not seem in character with how we play and the models seem kind of crappy to boot. Anyways, there are several 'unofficial' lists for elfs that i am wondering about:
    1) druchii.net has some Dark Elf Warbands tha they have playtested for 2 years that just came out in the latest Druchii Herald (including a Slaanesh DE list!) - has anyone played this or know anything about it?
    2) There supposedly was a Dark Elf Warband that was overpowered, then it was supposedly revamped to not be so overpowered and appeared on mordheimer.com as Druchii/Dark Elf Warband (i can find no trace of mordheimer.com or this Warband - any leads i can follow?)
    3) There is a High Elf Warband called "shadow warrior" - supposedly overpowered - is this true? If this list is overpowered, are there alternative HE Warbands that someone recommends?
    4) What about Wood Elfs? - any playtested Warbands for these? Or warbands that seem equal to the above two?

    Generally speaking, it seems as though these unofficial warband rules do have great potential for being unfair or overpowered as some claim - How can my friends and I play so that we have fair / equal powered warbands?

    Thanks for your help


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  3. #2
    Member Daemonslayer's Avatar
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    Hi me again.

    As it happens i have both played with and against both the shadow warrior warband and the dark elf warband. To be perfectly honest i must say that the dark elf warband is totally unbalanced (in their favour). Unfortunately this isnt just one thing but multiple things. This comes from my own personal experience, as well as that of my friends.

    First of all on the list contributing to this "unbalancing" would be the Sea Dragon Cloak, this is as it is almost twice as powerful as the sea dragon cloak in warhammer FB and in terms of what it gives you is very much under priced especially when you compare it to the "elven cloak" which has always been part of mordheim.

    Second is in my opinion the spell "deathspasm" which is incredibly overpowered, having the power to kill any single enemy model regardless of their current wounds, Toughness, or their armour save. And on top of that it can be used every turn. I know that it is unlikely that it will be cast often, but something that can suddenly kill a vampire with T6, 4W, a 3+ Armour Save, and a lucky charm without any chance of stopping it, seems a little bullsh*t to me.(pardon my french)

    The rest of the list is mostly alright, just a few minor problems, but none as major as the first two (although the 'Dark Elf Blade' weapon upgrade seems slightly overpowered also).

    There is of course the question of what the world are dark elves doing in mordheim to begin with? (this is also the position that games workshop take on the matter) as it seems that they have no business there (same with the shadow warrior warband as well actually)
    (dark elf warband can be found in the third instalment of the 'cities of gold' mordhiem rules found here Games Workshop Specialist Games)


    As for shadow warriors. They are not as unbalanced as the dark elves. Actually, the only reason (apart from the above reason of 'why?') was that they wern't properly adapted and as such the current list is unsuitable for mordheim. This is mainly due to special items like the standard, the horn, the familiar, and the runes which let you dispel enemy spells (the last one was mainly due to the unfair advantage it gave them over other warbands).

    There was a minor issue with a couple of the special skills as well, but they mostly seemed fine to me.
    (shadow warrior warband can be found here Games Workshop Specialist Games)


    The Issue you had with the models does not have to be an issue if you dont want it to be. You can just as easily use any other model that you see fit to represent your desired warband member. I myself have chosen to use the warhammer FB models instead of the Mordheim specific models. This is even less of a problem if you are not planning to enter a tournament with them as they dont have to look exactly the way a skaven wearing gromril with an elven cloak, armed with fighting claws, holding a shield in its tail should look (thats taking it a bit far but i feel i made my point).

    You will often find that when playing amongst friends a model doesnt have to be perfect, as long as the opponant knows what is what.

    There was also a wood elf warband that i saw somewhere but that was completely rediculous. Not only was it unbalanced but it was overly unsuitable for Mordheim.


    The issue of none of the official warbands suiting your particular style of play is a little more of an issue. However many people find that once they give them a chance and have a few test games, they find one or more that they like quite alot. You must remember that mordheim is very different in the way it is player to warhammer. This said, some "styles" of play may not be properly suited to mordheim as they are in warhammer. I for one am quite familiar with all of the main elven armies in warhammer FB and they are all either one of my primary, or secondary armies.

    Here are some ideas on warbands for elven styles of play:

    If you are one of the elven generals that likes to sit back and pummel the opposition with missile fire, then i would suggest either dwarves (although being an elf player i doubt you will choose them) or the Reiklanders. The dwarves get improved range for crossbows, handguns, and pistols, while all marksman in the Reiklander warband, not only have an impressive array of missile weapons to choose from, but their marksmen also start off with BS4 (very elfy)

    If you take the wood elf style of play, jumping out of nowhere and ripping the enemy apart with the multiple attacks. Then go skaven, they are fast moving, reasonably high initiative values, and can even infiltrate enemy territory (popping up from below and tearing them apart with their "fighting claws", and "the art of silent death")

    If you like to cause fear, making your enemy tremble before you, while at the same time being a sizable threat in combat (such as dryads, or cold ones), then maybe undead or chaos would be a good choice. There is no bigger threat in mordheim than a possessed or a vampire after all.

    Powerful magic with decent fighters? Then its orcs and goblins. They have some of the best spells in the game and a hoard of angry orcs to back it up! Theres not much that can take on an experienced orc warband and not take a vicoius beating in the process!

    If you like the High Elf ideals of pureness. There's always someone fighting for the side of good. Sisters of Sigmar are for you! They may be chicks. But they sure can be brutal, especially against the forces of evil (namely undead and chaos.... sometimes skaven too). Those sigmarite warhammers arnt just for show, they grant +1 strength, and give you a bonus to wound vs undead and possessed. If thats not enough then they have prayers too (some are actually quite powerful/useful).




    It is unfortunate that the elf warbands are "unofficial" but mostly this was done for fairness. If you have any further questions about Mordheim i'd be happy to answer them to the best of my knowledge, i am reasonably experienced at mordheim and know quite a bit about its rules and the official warbands.

  4. #3
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    In my old mordheim group, we played a lot with elves, and also played around a lot with designing new warbands. One player played elves almost exclusively, Dark Elves usually, and spent a long time working on a Wood Elves warband. I also played and played against the Shadow Warriors quite a lot.

    Shadow Warriors: I personally love the Shadow Warriors, although I think people have a point that they are on the overpowered side. For one thing, it's one of the only armies where every single model can be equipped for excellent range and melee fighting. The higher movement also allows them to outmaneuver their opponent, which is a totally legitimate advantage, but can be abused. Finally, they do have a combination of special abilities which allows them to fire from hiding and remain in hiding. It could be called cheesy, perhaps, but it's also not invulnerable... if he misses, the opponent has a greater chance of seeing him (I forget the exact rules) Also, it takes so many skills and experience to get, I don't begrudge them a powerful combination at high levels.

    While they are strong, I claim they fall within reasonable limits. The only time I've seen them genuinely abused was when the opponent used their greater movement to outmaneuver my poor dwarves, staying out of melee and shooting them to death, cutting corners so that only one dwarf at a time could see them to fire back. Some might say good tactics, but it was no fun at all to play against.

    Conclusion: I would play with or against the shadow warriors any day, although I would prefer to do it against an opponent with a sense of fair play. I don't think they're balanced with, say, the mercenary groups, but I think that's more from the mercenaries being underpowered than vice versa.

    Dark Elves: I did find the Dark Elves to be verifiably overpowered, for reasons that Daemonslayer spelled out admirably. I don't have anything to add on that front. With a little modification, they could be fair to play, except for the fact that you could make a strong argument that an entire movement 5 warband has no place in mordheim. But that would mean removing elves entirely, which profoundly doesn't sit well with me.

    Wood Elves: I wish I still had some of the old wood elves warbands we wrote up that I could show you. I liked some of the incarnations of it better than others. If you would like, respond and I can try and get a hold of them. I doubt they would actually be playable, but it would at least give people some food for thought if anyone wanted to take another stab at them.

  5. #4
    Member Sybaris Slaay's Avatar
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    Thanks for the insightful information - seems like there are several elements that do factor into the mix of fairness with respect to using elfs in Mordheim - yes if you can find any of the old experimental warbands you folks used for woodelfs let me know since my wife uses those. Also, i do like the experimental warbands for Mordheim featured in this month's druchii herald on druchii.net since they have a slaaneshi dark elf one ( i love cult of slaanesh). Anyways, thanks for the advice and take care

    ~sybaris slaay

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