Warmachine, Mark II Test Rules released - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    The Pacifist Wargamer Quick's Avatar
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    Warmachine, Mark II Test Rules released

    Privateer has released the Test (Beta) Ruleset for Warmachine. You have to register on Privateer's site to download them, but it also means you can provide your own feedback. (And since when does a company actually ask it's customers what it wants in a game? I'd be outraged at the breach of tradition if I weren't so delighted.)

    The points have changed for everything, a 200 point game is now an all-night affair. The special rules have been simplified and streamlined, replaced with little icons on a unit's statline. This is similar to Monsterpocalypse stuff.

    There's dozens of other things out there, but, in general, the game does feel more streamlined and less like a game that grew out of control, which, honestly, Warmachine had kind of become.

    Hordes players are currently left out in the cold a little as our own Mark II won't be along for a while yet.

    Download and discuss, please, PP fans.



    WHFB: Dwarfs || WH40k: Imperial Fists, Necrons || WM/H: Trollbloods || BFG: Necrons

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  3. #2
    Always Fabulous NiteRabbit's Avatar
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    Bane Knights are fixed! Glory days! My original worries about giving jacks that much MAT still stand though, in the sense that now the Stalker as good in melee as a Blighted Swordsman. That's pretty scary. Incidentally the Stalker is my new favorite warjack and reason enough to start Cryx. Actually it kinda hurts now, being the only one at our club without a real Warmachine army.

  4. #3
    Forward Kommander Blood_Blade's Avatar
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    Quick... you are quick!!!

    But yes, Mk II is out and all should rejoice! The only thing that saddens me is that the Spriggan apparently doesn't have reach or a effective shield... but that'll hopefully be clarified. Until then my pointy jack will be sidelined for more refreshing changes: cheap Juggernauts!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by MiketehFox View Post
    Ze KHADORANS vill Krush other puny factions into ze Dust! Then vill spread on Sandvich and eat! MMMMMmmmm...

  5. #4
    The Pacifist Wargamer Quick's Avatar
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    I'm rather excited that Epics can be used at all point levels. Since eSeverius was released, I always used that model because I like it better. Now I can actually use it.

    That said, though, a lot of the epics have been toned-down a little bit, so they're basically two discrete warcasters who have similar abilities and can't be fielded together.

    As much as PP likes to promote larger games, smaller ones are still the norm and I think too many people felt like they were unable to use their lovely models without being forced to play a massive game.

    The idea that Casters come with a Warjack-coupon of sorts is neat but unless I'm reading something wrong, it really doesn't look like there's still that much impetus to take them with most casters, save, of course, for the discount.

    Fielding 'Jacks is now done because they're almost free. I wonder if they'll do something similar with Hordes?

    I DO like that popping a unit leader doesn't castrate the unit, in most cases.
    I do NOT like the lack of unit size variability. The min or the max? A lot of list-tuning ability is lost and I think that a lot of units will be made obsolete by this because so many things all of the same cost.

    I think Infantrymachine will be now completely replaced with Solomachine.

    Edit:

    Bearing in mind this is a Beta and that these stats are not at all final, I think the most important improvement to the game will be this:

    A player no longer needs to memorize every faction's units to be competitive.

    This is something that frustrates new and old players alike. (My girlfriend will only play against models she has seen before, because she thinks it's unfair that I show up with something she's never seen and looks just like any other heavily armored Trollkin.)

    By standardizing rules that were all basically the same into rules that actually ARE the same, there's that much more you can remember about your opponent's models. The game, then, goes back to being a strategy game, before it became large and unwieldy.

    Hordes doesn't suffer from this as much at the moment because of the facts that it's a younger game, and it was built by more experienced designers.

    In the beta's current state, Menoth got toned-down significantly.
    Last edited by Quick; April 7th, 2009 at 03:52.


    WHFB: Dwarfs || WH40k: Imperial Fists, Necrons || WM/H: Trollbloods || BFG: Necrons

  6. #5
    Always Fabulous NiteRabbit's Avatar
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    I had an interesting discussion with a Cygnar player the other night during which I addressed his concerns that Cygnaran infantry had somehow been nerfed into oblivion thus rendering Infantrymachine obsolete (he prefers to be able to take such an army if he wants and have it be viable, rather than having any bias towards the concept). There was something wrong with this statement, I felt, so I had a talk with them and was eventually able to get to the core of their resentment - the Black 13th having been deprived of most of their special abilities and Gun Mages no longer being able to hit cortex boxes with their guns. The vast majority of Cygnaran infantry stayed the same, and some even got better, that sorely needed it. The end result was that only Stormblades and Gun Mages really changed significantly with Trenchers needing to center their AOE smoke within 3" rather than placing it within 3", which really makes more sense and is more consistent with other AOE effects. Oh yeah their Bayonet Charge rule got replaced by the functionally similar Assault.

    In conclusion, I agree with PP in urging caution when discussing the new rules - cooler heads must prevail here and only after getting a few games under our belt can we truly get a verdict on what we think about this stuff.

    In other news, Goreshade can't terrify people with his feat anymore. Warmachine is now ruined FOREVER!

  7. #6
    The Pacifist Wargamer Quick's Avatar
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    The Cygnar players may be crying, but the Menites are contemplating suicide.

    Being primarily Hordes players, we have the luxury of being able to view these changes from more of an academic perspective. Most WM players are bemoaning the nerfing of their favorite unties.

    The need to standardize troops and in a way make them more anonymous comes with making the armies themselves more distinct. (Again, they started this is Hordes where all Trolls are Tough, all Circlers are Pathfinders, etc.)

    The positive in this, which is, I'm sure, PP's intent is to reduce the prevalence of 'auto-includes'. A player should be allowed to design along a theme, rather than, "you need to take the following units."


    WHFB: Dwarfs || WH40k: Imperial Fists, Necrons || WM/H: Trollbloods || BFG: Necrons

  8. #7
    Skeletor=Pimp. Stunted_Merc's Avatar
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    DMC, Nite and I have been discussing this like all day yesterday lol. I have a thread for all MkII related news in the Warmachine area, which is still pretty much dead but I plan to stick to my guns and bring it up to a competent level.

    Overall I am pleased and hesitant, I will wait until the final product roles around to fully judge it. I see a lot of my fellow Merc players crying foul, though I find the idea of cheap infantry to horde around with pretty good 'Jacks and the amazing new Magnus fun.

    Also Epics can apparently fit in ANY point cost now, so cheers. Well Quick said this, I might just pick up that Magnus the Warlord blister today and see what I can make from a paint scheme.

    -K
    Last edited by Stunted_Merc; April 7th, 2009 at 22:13.

  9. #8
    Always Fabulous NiteRabbit's Avatar
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    With regard to the loss of many rules that people would consider 'characterful', I feel that pain. However, someone on the PP forums pointed out that back when Prime was first released, units didn't have a mountain of special rules. Bane Thralls, for example, had Stealth, Weapon Master, and Dark Shroud, and that was it. People still loved Warmachine back then. When you put things in that perspective, it seems more like a return to basics than stripping units of their flavour.

  10. #9
    Suffer not the Unclean InquisitorAffe's Avatar
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    I am really excited to try out the new core rules. On what they did to all my favorite units, I'm torn. I'm kind of hoping some things just plain haven't really been looked at yet. What they did to Cryx's (and of course other people's too) Legends content is just mind boggling. I'd want a refund on all those models if this were the 'final' version of MKII!

    I think I have a bad taste just because it really really feels like on the initial impression that they made all the models I already own worthless and I'll have to now go buy all the ones that I don't have if I want a competitive army in this ruleset. It feels like the classic MMO overbalance of nerfing the good stuff into obscurity.

    Overall early impression: changes to core system and overall simplification of game, epic win. Model/unit rebalancing that for all the world (and this comes from a dyed in the wool fanboy) like it was crafted purely to make me buy more models, failboat.

  11. #10
    Skeletor=Pimp. Stunted_Merc's Avatar
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    Well I am ready for MkII, bring it on. Just did a trade: my TB's (Waiting on Quick to give me the Trollbloods are to tough and everyone is leaving them speech) and some Tau for a butt load of Mercs, here is the rundown.

    Warcasters:

    Magnus the Traitor
    Fiona the Black
    Broadside Bart
    Gorten Grundback
    Durgen Madhammer

    Warjacks:

    Mangler
    Renegade
    2x Talon
    Nomad
    6x (!) Grundback Gunners
    3x Ghordson Drillers (That I can see)
    Freebooter
    Mariner
    Buccaneer
    Mule
    Vanguard

    Units/Solos/whatever:

    Thor Steinhammer
    Master Gunner Dougal
    Kell Bailoch
    Eiryss
    Orin Midwinter
    Herne & Jonne
    Croe's Cutthroats (Full unit)
    Dirty Meg (Cardless)

    About all I can see, still pretty good. Dunno why I have six Gunners, checked to see if they had different weaponry but it's all the same.

    Other than the lack of one-wound units, pretty sweet deal. I have the cards for the High Shields and Steelheads, but no models can be found for 'em. Still I got A LOT I can use for Magnus & Friends, just need to get some Steelheads and start stripping these.

    MkII playtests in the store will happen apparently soon, I doubt it until summer though.

    -K
    Last edited by Stunted_Merc; April 8th, 2009 at 07:37.

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