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Looking for comments mainly on if LO thinks the points value seems fair.
I could also use a different name for the Iron Hands rule, to avoid using the name of the SM chapter.
Chosen of Endymion
You may only take one squad of Chosen of Endymion for up to every 1000 points in your army, and only if Endymion himself is in the force. (an army of 0-1000 pts may take 1 squad, 1000-2000 pts may take 2, and so on)
The Chosen of Endymion were marines among the psykers' personal guard during the flight from the dark angels. Fiercely loyal to him, They remain with him to this day, though their numbers have been greatly depleted by fatalaties of war. The constant interference over the centuries of the the psyker guiding their minds in battle has had a lasting effect on them, and as a result, they fight with exceptional skill - They are deadly accurate with their ranged weaponry, and are masters of hand to hand combat.
26 points each
WS BS S T W I A L SV
5 5 4 4 1 4 1 10 3+
Close Combat Weapon
Iron Hands (as a result of countless centuries fighting with the bloody crescents, wielding all manner of plasma weaponry, The Chosen of Endymion have developed a resistance to the heat created by the plasma, so through a combination of natural endurance and cybernetic enhancements/replacements of burned parts, Chosen of Endymion will only suffer "Gets Hot!" wounds on a roll of a 4+, with saving throws being applied afterwards)
One model may be upgraded to an Aspiring Champion for 10 pts. (Aspiring champions have +1 A)
He may replace his
- Bolter with a Plasma Gun for +10 points
- Bolt Pistol with a Plasma Pistol for +10 points
- Close Combat Weapon with a Power Weapon for +15 points
Any number of Chosen of Endymion may upgrade their bolters to plasma guns, or their bolt pistols to plasma pistols at +10pts per model
The squad may have a Chaos Rhino dedicated transport vehicle.
This belongs in the Rules Development forum. No problem. I'll go ahead and punt it on over.
Right. You have hear a basic chaos marine template with additional enhancements for WS & BS, along with some pretty tight restrictions on weapon upgrades. Sounds pretty balanced at this point. If anything, it may be a little too restricting. Before I go any further, I'm having trouble conceptualizing why this unit would have a +1 WS, when really, the presence of all those potential plasma guns should discourage them from ever entering into c.c.. Just a question more than anything. I suppose I'll answer it myself by directing my brain towards the plasma pistol option. Right, problem solved.
Champion: Why not provide him with the full chaos arsenal available to other chaos chosen? No power fist? No combi-weapons. I know your unit is highly specialized, but even in these cases, our champs are renowned for their skills in using all kinds of fancy-shmancies I don't see why yours should be any different.
Plasma gun cost: Owing to the precedence of our codex, the price should be bumped up to 15 points per gun. It's best to keep things as consistent as possible. However, in order to compensate this increase, you could reduce the cost of each model. I think this will work better in the end. As well, it makes players pay more for the upgrades, while at the same time, maintaining a cheaper unit base. This has all sorts of advantages. For example, let's say I only want three plasma guns in this squad. In this case, I'm not paying out the bottom for each basic model in order to get the squad count up. Makes sense?
I see the chosen of Endymion as filling very similar roles as a plasma chosen squad and our plasma havocs. Just for comparison, I'll sum up one of each and see how they compare to your Endymion:
Chosen squad- 221
*7x chosen with glory icon
**4x plamsa guns
**champ with power weapon
Havoc squad- 230
*7x havocs with glory icon
**4x plasma guns
**champ with power weapon
Chosen of Endymion squad- 282
*7x chosen with glory icon (assuming they can take the icon)
*4x plasma guns
**champ with power weapon
How do you think your above squad compares to the havocs and chosen? I'm still mulling it over.
Spambot kill tally. . .337
I could knock the WS down to 4. It was more of an obligation rather than something I would use anyway. The plan as you clearly saw was to generally equip the unit with plasma guns.
What do you think would be a good base cost then? Basically I will have taken a chaos chosen marine, added 1 to his BS, and swapped his infiltrate rule for my Iron hands rule.
I'm not an expert with the new edition of the chaos codex, I haven't had it long. - by the way.
As for your comparison, looking at it like that they DO look overpriced, but then you get an extra BS and an extra save against "gets hot attacks"
If I took them as being 20pts/model and +15 for plasma weapons, The squad you wrote up would be reduced to 270 points if I am correct?
Also about the wargear on the champion and the icon - I'll ad them probably, yeah. I'm mre concentrating on the core theme at the moment before I go adding option I probably won't use
What if all those rifles were Plasma Cannons?
When creating a unit of your own design, you really need to sit down and think of what the unit's purpose will be. If you're really looking at it from a gaming standpoint, you don't want them to serve the same purpose as another, pre-established unit in the codex, or even really a very similar purpose. If you're just going at it from a fluff/modeling standpoint, then you can really do whatever you'd like as far as rules go (or maybe use them as counts-as models). It's important to think of what you'd use them for vs. other choices in the codex, and roll with that.
That's one of the difficult things about the CSM codex - they have a unit for just about everything!
This unit is basically designed for taking out relatively (compared to other CSM units anyway) large amounts of enemy marine infantry, whilst still being manouverable and being able to fire the full 24" of their weapons.
I actully came up with the idea for this unit originally before I got the new codex, and was gutted to see they'd been usurped by the 1k sons. They would have been pretty unique going by the old rules. This unit still has various advantages over the Sons though - they have a higher BS, and have capacity to take out most lighter tanks / walkers / termies / monsters if neccessary.
They are pretty heavy in with the fluff for my chapter as well, But if you browse the forums enough you'll know I'm still changing all that at the moment.