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This was gonna be in response to the topic put up about the Avatar under a week ago before it was deleted, particularly what Lord-Link said about the Avatar needing his Strength and Toughness increasing (maybe add another Attack too, yah ;-))
Anyway, basically with the release of a new, larger Avatar model from FW here and a new one of similar size on it’s way from GW I was wondering if they’ll be new rules to test out with it ala the FW Greater Daemons makeover. I’ve been thinking about this a lot there and I have this basic idea to keep all Eldar players happy who are worried about another hike in point’s costs.
Basically, according to fluff (I don’t know where, but various people keep on mentioning it) the Avatar can grow in different sizes right? Well why not give him different stats and abilities according to how much larger he is? You could keep the old AND recent codex stats for the old/current model that is much easier to hide within the battlefield and have better stats with a relative point increase for the big, new model. I was thinking the old __ pt version, the recent ___pt version and maybe one that is about 250pts max could all be playable depending on the Eldar players’ desire. So you basically have three different versions you could play! What do y’all think? It would definitely make all those happy who still want a low cost HQ while keeping the rest of us pleased who want the powerhouse back who could thrash about a Greater Daemon like pastry.
Also I’m really keen to hear what improvements you’d like to see made to the new Avatar’s rules if GW/FW decided to create some. I have some of my own ideas but would really like to hear what everyone else has to say before I write another novel-sized reply to the idea.
Last edited by Katie Drake; March 22nd, 2007 at 18:39.
I could definately see paying maybe 50 points more for a better avatar of some sort, but an extra 100 points just seems like too much. But that could just be me, i wouldn't really like puting 250 points into a monstrous creature.
For an extra 50 points i'd like to see the avatar have the scout rule. Only because i've played in tournaments and i hate it when escalation turns up and my avatar can't be on the board 1st turn to make my stuff fearless. Also giving him the ability to fleet would be nice too, because his one huge weakness is his speed. So would an extra 50 points be good for scout and fleet? or is that too much for 50 points?
edit: nope scout and fleet couldn't be used together, that would give him the possibility of assaulting first turn, i just realized that
Last edited by Katie Drake; March 22nd, 2007 at 18:39.
You would like to see the Avatar with the scout and fleet rule?
Ok, as long as my wraithlord can have wings and twinlinked d-cannons. And while were at it lets give falcons and prisms armour 14 on all sides yea.
You generally don't see monstrous creatures wearing guile suits and carrying around sniper rifles, but it might be ok as long as we give rangers str 10 power weapons. With these changes in place however, it would seem unfair on the humble guardian, so I supose we would have to arm them all with battlecannons at the very least....
Does this mean that giving him his own ripping assault bike is out of the question for those extra points . Seriously, I can't see infiltrate working... unless... he's Alatioc-based Avatar which would fit in nicely with the theme. One Idea I did have was craftworld-based Avatars. I.E - the Ulthwe Avatar could has a unique save against magic attacks or have a retunue of Warlocks ala The Spear of Khaine.
But anyway, the reason why I suggested bringing back the old 80pt version was as a cheap HQ alternative to all the expensive one's the Eldar have now. I know some people have commented on that before. And as for 250pts, alot of unique special characters for other armies are around that amount.
I don't see what's wrong with giving him fleet. A blood thirster has wings and so can a hive tyrant. Fleet isn't as nasty as wings.
As far as scout goes, i usually use my avatar in my alaitoc ranger army, not only would it be cool to have an avatar that could scout with my rangers, but its also very frustrating to take him in a game to get his fearless ability, just to end up playing an escalation game, and then having to wait for him come onto the board on turn 4. I'd definately pay some extra points to give him the scout ability in my alaitoc army.
Also keep in mind giving him one of these abilities would add to the cost of him.
To Oiad: i didn't say give him infiltrate, i said give him scout.
And lastly, what is the point of you're post $ick, there is nothing constructive about it, why would you come on here just to fire off a paragraph of nothing but sarcastic insults?
Last edited by xinsanityx; March 19th, 2007 at 04:53.
Hmmm, a few reasons.
One - boredom.
Two - Because giving an avatar scout and/or fleet would be silly.
Three - Because I thought that people could take a joke. It seems a lot of people on this forum take this game waaaay to seriously, it is after all only a game.
Lighten up people.
I don't know how much more powerfull the Avatar has to get my ole' 3rd edit got mobbed by a about max strength mob of boyz and he got half of them entirely on his own before he went down (mind you after that most people avoided him and used him as an 80 pt walking gunnery target) and so I would pay extra for a little more power but I'm not after much of a price or ability increase over 3rd at present
Sorry, that's my fault. I have a tendency to get them mixed up. I do agree he shouldn't have both fleet and scout though. What about a 12" charge with Furious. Or extending the Wailing Doom's range to 18" like a Fire Pike.To Oiad: i didn't say give him infiltrate, i said give him scout.
Did you like the Craftworld-based idea then xinsanityx ? I think those abilites would suit him in that case.
yeah the craftworld idea i like, because the only craftworld that the avatar really seems to fit with now is the biel-tan craftworld. The alaitoc army is a scouting/infilitrating/fleet of foot type army. The saim hann army is a fast mounted army. The iyanden army is a wraithguard/wraithlord army and needs farseers as hq's and are already all fearless. And an ulthwe craftworld is supposed to be farseer and guardian based, so if you put him in you're losing a farseer, and then its not really and ulthwe army. I'm not saying the avatar doesn't have a place in all these armies, i'm just saying he seems kind of out of place in all of them, and having the option to give him specialized craftworld options for the appropriate point cost seems like a decent idea to me.
Giving him the scout option for alaitoc, giving him some sort of psychic power for ulthwe, making him a spiritseer for iyanden(i dunno only thing i could think of), giving him some sort of speed upgrade for saim-hann, and bringing back the court for biel-tann. Giving him the option to extend the wailing doom's range to 18' like a fire pike isn't a bad idea either
That's preeety awesome, kinda what I had thought. Depending on the Craftworld he could take a small retinue of the popular unit choice. So Iyanden could have their Avatar be accompanied by Wraithguard. In return, yesm the Avatar could provide a 12" guide from Wraithsight. His Wailing Doom could even work more like a wraithcannon rather than a flamer ! I play Ulthwe, and as much as I like the council it wouldn't hurt to have that alternative HQ choice, especially in a situation where I'm expecting a heavy assault.
There hasn't been much talk about it but how much do you think he should increase by stat-wise? I made a misatke with the maths. Say he was 230 points max.