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ok so i am new to skaven and trying to setup a fluff army to buy and get me started...i wanted to list one of my ideas here and try to get a few clarifyng questions answered to see how viable the list is. First the questions:
The rat ogres and giant rats...this question is related mostly to giant rats on hindsight but ill check for both. They are a mixed units with the packmasters, so how do you work out ranks? The brb talks about with monstrous infantry they can get the rank bonus with 3 units wide if all models in the unit are monstrous infantry, so my addon question for ogres is do i need them to be 5 wde or 3, and the whip choices for the moulders show they get a single attack from rear ranks, does this matter how far back in the ranks they are?
Second question is on Throt the Unclean. It says in the book you can take giant rats as core choices...but arnt they core choices anyways? It then says you can take up to two units of rat ogres as core choices. Is this old now that the rules show just percentage based instead of actual unit groups, and furthermore is there a limit on how many models can be in each unit under this rule?
finally for the horde rule on ogres...if they are horde at 6 wide do they get full attacks for the third row? please answer this one even if they have to be 10 wide still
those are my three big questions for now so onto the help with the army idea! What started this idea is looking for a close combat varient of skaven. I came to the idea of trying to make an army based around mutants in general...giant rats, ogres, abominations ect. Im thinking of the vermin lord and of course throt the unclean as lord choices, but i need at least some level of magic mixed in...maybe a grey seer or thanquol to control the mutations? I havnt gotten my army book yet so dont have the full background of skaven to read up on yet. I would love some feedback on if this type of build is even realistic and/or ideas on what to do with it!
I should end with these army lists im looking at are hopefully going to be between 2.5 and 4k i dont want to go above 4k
Last edited by Liathaneo; February 28th, 2012 at 18:17.
ROs are monstrous infantry and therefore only need 3 wide for a rank and 6 wide for a horde. The book says whips can attack over one rank of ROs or 3 ranks of GRs, so they'd have to be in the second rank of a RO unit to get any attacks (I'm pretty sure this hold true in a horde as well, and besides, I'd much rather want another rank of RO attacks). Packs are just there for a small LD boost in RO units. They can, however, be in the 4th rank of a GR horde and cause it to have 4 ranks of attacks.
Throt- You now have to have at least 25% of your points come from core. The obvious one is the rat ogres, 2 units of them become core, therefore counting towards your core requirement instead of eating precious non-core points. As for giant rats, they generally do not 'count towards the required number of core units'... which in 8th now means they don't count toward your core point requirement. They might as well be special. With Throt, now they do count.
Unit sizes are limited in the book, I'm not sure what they are off hand, check the army list entry for limitations.
cool that covers the questions pretty thoouroughly thanks...only question you didnt cover is if i did run RO as a horde would the third rank (assuming they were RO not packs) get all their attacks same as the rule for MI in the second row?
what about thoughts on the general army idea as a whole?
Yep, 3 row attacks in a horde.
I have been secretly tossing around the idea of a RO horde list with Throt and Skweel at the helm. Win or lose, that list would be hilarious to field, and if Skweel gave the ROs regen... that would be frightening.
You'd just have to take a lot of pack masters, Throt gets hungry...
Yeah so with RO in a unit of 6 deployed 3 accross 2 deep you get 18 attacks, +3 if your frenzy so thats 21 attacks total. Thats a lot of attacks, although you do need account for hits.
I would assume it would be better to keep Throt in a Giant rat unit, so that he can ear giant rats rather than a whole rat ogre.
Throt can eat packmasters, so just take extra in his RO unit as his personal buffet.
Fear me, mortals, for I am The Anointed, The Favored Son of Chaos, The Scourge of the World. The armies of the Gods rally behind me, and it is by My Will and by My Sword that your weakling nations shall fall. - Archaon, The Everchosen, Lord of the End Times
i shelved this idea for a week or two to try out my other idea first but ya the rats look good too and will definitely be in this army but Throt is a hard hitter and meant to be in a hard hitting group so i think he will end up in a big block of RO especialy since the packmasters wont be able to attack through 2 ranks of RO anyways