Who suffers the most from the new space marine?

[Cpeerson2000]

Originally Posted by Roland Durendal

I'm on the fence right now about this whole move toward "Use established chapters. No more DIY Chapters".

Originally Posted by stayscrunchyinmilk

:and not being able to compete in tournaments as the GW tournament package states that SM armys painted as a specific chapter, with specific traits cannot be used as another chapter.

ok so I wont be able to make my own chapter for painting purposes? I was thinking of starting a Space Marine army but this kind of worries me.

[!Shpongle]

I'm sure you could paint them a bit differently, but painted to look like a different chapter and without the right iconography, then trying to use the rules for a different chapter will not work...

[Zarahemna]

That doesn't sound right at all.

What you cannot really do is paint your marines to look like Blood Angels and then use Dark Angels rules, or Ultramarines rules. If you paint your marines to look like a recognised chapter, such as the Black Templars then it is a little unfair to use a different recognised army's rules.

Even then, most friendly players wouldn't have a problem. You would run into trouble at a tournament though.

As for making up your own chapter. You can do this and then use any codex you want. Any codex. So for example you make up your new chapter. Shiny Marines of Death. Then you decide you want to use the BA codex. No problem. DA instead, no problem. You could even convert your marines to carry Tay weapons and then use the Tau Empire army list. Have you ever heard of the Grot Rebellion? That uses this principle.

Again, you only run into trouble when you put an army on the table that looks like one army and then claim it is actually another.

[Wolf Lord Herby]

I'm sure you could use the Counts As rules for the new Special Characters, to represent heroes from successor chapters/ whole new chapters... Even in a tournament situation, so long as you told your opponnent before the battle, checked with the tournament organisers before the tournie, and used the right weapons and equipment on the charac.

And @ Phalanx: the Space Wolf FAQ tells us to take vehicle points costs from the new SM Codex. So we pay the same for vehicles as most SMs. The wonders of being the only Codex to have not been upgraded to stand-alone, not counting EoT armies...

[wretched]

Well, if you have built and painted your 5 man Terminator Squads to have 2 special weapons in them, then your in for a bit of a shock now that you can only have 1.

So I would say Terminator players suffer most, if that counts.

EDIT: Also, anyone that has built an army based on the traits rules of 4th Ed. Example, I used 3 full Terminator Squads as elite, 2 Terminator Squads as HQ Command Squads and 3 dreadnoughts as Heavy Support. Now no longer possible. This makes models redundant, which is most irksome.

I think the gamer suffers most to be honest.

wretched

[Phalanx]

Originally Posted by Wolf Lord Herby

And @ Phalanx: the Space Wolf FAQ tells us to take vehicle points costs from the new SM Codex. So we pay the same for vehicles as most SMs. The wonders of being the only Codex to have not been upgraded to stand-alone, not counting EoT armies...

Sweet. I was origionally (once I get AOBR) just going to use normal marine rules until the SW book came out, but I think I might try to just use the SW one right off the bat if they use the standard SM prices. Gotta keep saving up for some AOBR boxes.... (and then trying to find some nice pelty-pieces to modify them with).

As for the wretched, generally extreme armies like that get nerfed when a new book comes out. Its hardly something new- GW doesn't like things being spammed like that. Besides, that many terminators looks like something more reserved for Apoc or a deathwing army than a standard SM force. Besides, if you could still use everything the traits system offered now, then what would be the use of getting rid of it? It'd be like C:CSM 3.5 Loyalist edition.

[darkness55]

I actually went to a tournament recently with my BT army, I was getting ready, checked the new 5th edition rules, proceded to my marines and ripped off every power fist in the army. lol. The all master crafted power swords were quite the plus but just not as reliable as a good old power fist. My templars still did ok though, but i would love a FAQ to come out so I can re attach some of those power fists.

[Frankmaneldar]

As someone who is less-then-friendly towards the escalating weirdness of SM rules I can say I'll be pleased if I know what I'm up against by knowing the army.

It was getting really old having to get the 5 min speal on how this kewl new chapter has xy trait etc etc. and having to double check to make sure "mistakes" weren't made.

Honestly, if I can fairly closely replicate my eldar's tactics with SM with cheaper and more effective models there is an issue.

Anything that simplifies Sm rules is good for the game as a whole. A SM nerf isn't bad news either. It might make Sm players learn tactics faster. The current perpetual "Picket's charge" is lame.

Don't worry, you'll get over it. I'm almost over what they did to eldar when they went to 3ed.

As far as what to do when your favorit emodels now suck? I put those squads away and waited for the next ED. They all play differnet and they always shift the strength to the previously neglected squads.

Good luck, and it will honestly be okay. You just may have to pay retail for your upgrades like the rest of us.

[Skarsgard]

Thread Closed to stop necro-posting and polling.