Shrike's Wing

[Animastrife]

Are Shrike's Wings worth it? They are really expensive and terminators can use lightning claws.

[Archetype-]

Hello, there. Good to see another Shadow Captain. If you ever need help with the sons of Corax, feel free to PM me.

To answer your question, Shrike and his Wing are definitely not worth the points. It's a suicidal point sink. I recommend you read my Raven Guard Tactica for more details. Just be aware that it'll be revised soon. My opinion on Shrike and his Wing will still be unchanged. You're better off taking either an Assault Leader, an Avenging Angel, or a Wraithmage and having them join an Elite Assault Squad. For more details (and a teaser), check out my entry in the Space Marine HQ Tactica thread stickied at the top of the page. The only time I'd ever use Shrike is for his bitz.

Victorus aut mortis,
-Archetype

[Brother Darien]

hmm, well considering that with the new codex those other HQ's dont exist I'd say worth it.

Why? A few reasons, first terminators dont get "Strike From The Shadows" i.e. infiltrate, scout and stealth.

Second Termies dont move 12" in the movement phase.

Third, Termies don't get Frag and Krak Grenades. Third Shrike is fast and powerful and rend makes him real dangerous, plus his lightning claws are master crafted.

Fouth thier stats combined with their rules, whilst requiring some care as they are expensive are extremely powerful when termies have "Strike From The Shadows" then Shrike won't be worth it till then I shall consider Shrike very worth it.

[Phalanx]

He means assault squads, not termy assault squads. Archetype, can you link to the Raven Guard tactica? Personally, the only info I have on the sons of Corax is from the index astartes in an old WD. I'd like to know more if you have any more links to more fluff or anything.

As for shrike, I'd personally make him and his wing just for coolness factor, but generally just use his wing as random vet sarges and stuff depending on how I make my army. Lots of scouts, infantry, and assault squads. It'd be fun having an army where nothing starts in your deployment zone. Heh.

[Archetype-]

Originally Posted by Brother Darien

first terminators dont get "Strike From The Shadows" i.e. infiltrate, scout and stealth.

Since when did characters need special rules like these to be powerful? Shrike only benefits from these rules if he's taken with his Wing, and that adds up to an unnecessarily expensive HQ. A base Shrike and Wing will run you 379 points, and you do not get the benefit of the hidden power fist. This is the folly of GW allowing special characters to be taken without an opponent's consent.

Originally Posted by Brother Darien

Second Termies dont move 12" in the movement phase.

Assault Terminators can easily get a charge if you put them in a Land Raider or an LRC. Besides, this proves nothing except that the squad can die faster.

Originally Posted by Brother Darien

Third, Termies don't get Frag and Krak Grenades. Third Shrike is fast and powerful and rend makes him real dangerous, plus his lightning claws are master crafted.

Firstly, krak grenades are nowhere near as effective as melta bombs at wrecking enemy armor, and Terminators don't need grenades to be effective. Secondly, Shrike has no invulnerable save, which makes him vulnerable to power weapons/fists/MCs. Thirdly, rending on a power weapon is redundant. Power weapons ignore armor saves anyway, so you don't need rending. Rending and power weapons still allow invulnerable saves. Fourthly, Shrike has WS 5 (as all Space Marine HQs do) and should hit often enough. A single re-roll is not worth it for the points it costs. You want re-rolls on failed to-hits? Get a Chaplain and get the charge. Then the whole squad can re-roll any failed to-hits.

Originally Posted by Brother Darien

Fouth thier stats combined with their rules, whilst requiring some care as they are expensive are extremely powerful when termies have "Strike From The Shadows" then Shrike won't be worth it till then I shall consider Shrike very worth it.

This isn't really an arguement for Shrike and his Wing, and the squad is still too fragile for the cost. A canny opponent will target Shrike and his Wing and wipe it out before it reaches his lines. It's an easy 379 points minimum that can be won with a single ordnance blast. That is why Shrike isn't worth it.

Victorus aut mortis,
-Archetype

EDIT: Phalanx, if you can PM me with the WD issue number that the article appears in, that would be much appreciated. I plan on picking up Index Astartes IV, which contains Raven Guard fluff among other things. In the meantime, here are a couple of links.

Raven Guard Tactica 1.0

Raven Guard Tactica 1.1 teaser (HQ)

Grimbog Elf Ater's RG fluff

If you have any more questions about Raven Guard, fell free to drop a line in my inbox.

[GrandMasterNemesiiii]

archetype your complaining about point sink what about the termie assault squad in a landraider
the raider alone is 250 and who in thier right minds wouldnt target your raider with most if not all of thier AA to take it out quickly and put u down assloads of points (alot more than shrike and wing i'd say)

so if your ask me shrike will be worth it just infiltrate some other squads with him and bum rush

[Archetype-]

Originally Posted by GrandMasterNemesiiii

archetype your complaining about point sink what about the termie assault squad in a landraider

Dude, I don't use either of the two. I have my assault taken care of in the form of Assault Squads and Scouts. Much fluffier than Terminators or Assault Terminators. Of course, if you want to use a Terminator Command Squad as a secondary HQ i games of 1,850+ points then by all means do so. Just be sure to put a Librarian with FotD with them and teleport them in when you play Tau or IG.

Originally Posted by GrandMasterNemesiiii

so if your ask me shrike will be worth it just infiltrate some other squads with him and bum rush

And if you happen to be playing a scenario that doesn't involve Infiltrate, that plan gets shot to hell, blasted back here, then catapulted back to hell again. Even with the other special rules he has, a customized Master/Chaplain/Librarian joining an Elite Assault Squad can do better and earn their points back.

[Tycho]

If i were to ever play Raven Guard there would be now way id take Shrike and his wing.They are a huge waist of points for what they have.Like Archetype said Assault squads are much more cost effective than Shrike and his companions and can deal out alot of damage for less points.

[Viktor]

Shrike is a very nice looking model though, and that's a good reason to use him as an ordinary Master. Also, i can nowhere find that Shrike cannot use the strike from the shadows rules unless accompanied by his wing, in the codex it says that Shrike posses those rules too.
But since i generally stay away from special characters except for fluff reasons, i wouldn't recommend using his rules unless you are running a story-based campain.

[Lost Nemesis]

Originally Posted by Viktor

Shrike is a very nice looking model though, and that's a good reason to use him as an ordinary Master..

Amen to that. That's the only way I'd ever use Shrike - I love that model. Beakie!!!

I'm by no means a Space Marine veteran, player, or even much of a fan except for those odd armies, but I would like some info..

hmm, well considering that with the new codex those other HQ's dont exist I'd say worth it.

Archetype, can you address this please? Any versions of armies with different choices in it are always interesting for me.