Scout Sniper Squad ?

[praxis]

Only got the new rulebook a couple of days ago, and reading through it I had the notion that a scout squad composed mainly of snipers could cause a serious amount of aggro, what with the long range and easy hits, pinning rules and ability to wack high toughness models. Would also fit in with my bias towards having a shooty army. Even if my opponent concentrated on them and they got wasted super quick it would allow the less mobile units to advance unhindered.

Thoughts and advise gratefully recieved, as i hav'nt played for several years and still got some finishing touches to my ultras before i can.

Current army (nearing completion, only basing left)

between 5000 and 6000 points of Ultramarines
1500 points of undead that might as well have stayed dead

[Tycho]

Yes scout snipers are pretty cool and effective.They are good at pinning down units and taking on high toughness things like you said.
One word of advice though if you are to make a scout sniper squad.Equip the whole squad with snipers and maybe chuck in a ML if you want but dont mix them with bolters or ccw and bp scouts.Mixing just doesnt work.
Cheers,
Tycho

[Grey]

Quote: dont mix them with bolters or ccw and bp scouts.Mixing just doesnt work

Hmm. Even with the sniper scouts in cover, they're going to attract some firepower from your opponent. I find that I like having a cheap scout or two with no upgrades in my squad to take the first hit(s), so I don't lose the sniper rifles or heavy wepon right away. Plus its an easy way to bulk up the unit to make it more resistant to break checks.
However I'm assuming you meant mixing more along the lines of 50/50. Then yes, I agree, such a squad doesn't know what it wants to do.

[Viktor]

That scout is still far more useful when upgraded with a sniper rifle than without when acting meat shield. Another thing, when you use snipers you should have at least 6 to make them reliable, you need to kill at least one enemy to force pinning test as you know. It also makes them more stable, and makes them work better as infiltrating table quarter claimers.

[jtm]

Quote: dont mix them with bolters or ccw and bp scouts.Mixing just doesnt work

Hmm. Even with the sniper scouts in cover, they're going to attract some firepower from your opponent. I find that I like having a cheap scout or two with no upgrades in my squad to take the first hit(s), so I don't lose the sniper rifles or heavy wepon right away. Plus its an easy way to bulk up the unit to make it more resistant to break checks.
However I'm assuming you meant mixing more along the lines of 50/50. Then yes, I agree, such a squad doesn't know what it wants to do.

Generally though if you're using sniper scouts you take a full squad of 10, one may have a heavy bolter or missile launcher. They're not as threatening as most people think, most things will still get an armor save against them. In most armies who are you going to be worried about, a couple scouts, that devastator squad, that predator near the woods, those land speeders flying around, or that assault squad moving towards your lines? Most of the time sniper scouts are very low in terms of target priority.

[Silver Wings]

If you compare a 5 man scout Sniper Squad to a 5 man Tactical squad with lascannon, both cost 90pts, but the Marines have a 3+ save.

Bolters are better than sniper rifles against everything T3. Or worse than 4+ save.

Plus 1 lascannon will do 0.55 wounds per turn on 2+ save MC's where 5 Snipers will do 0.34.

So the scouts dont do too well there. They do have infiltrate, but usualy you dont want to go towards the enemy with sniper rifles so thats less of a bonus.

And if your opponent has any ap4 firepower lying arround then the scout snipers at 3pts more than a Tactical marine each are quite a target.

[Blue Wave]

Scouts are good at wounding things like nightbringers and wraithlords, but I preffere tac squads better to kill almost every thing else. Pluse 3+ armour save is much better.

[Silver Wings]

Scouts are one of the best things we have against Nightlords, always wound on a 4+ is useful on a T8 model and its save isn't brilliant.

Lascannon and Assault cannon are better against WL, it takes an average of 23 sniper shots to take one down, but only 18 Assault cannon (shots) (rending only) and only 8 lascannon.

Your point is good but C'tan are quite rare (though very common for a God) and WL are better targeted with ap3 stuff.

[Liono]

As pointed out, sniper scouts are more expensive and not as usefull as marines. However they are great at pulling fire if used properly. For example if infiltration is a possibility then you are hurting your chances by not taking scouts. Do you care if you lost a unit of scouts if it drew most of your opponents fire for a turn while your Rino's and other troops are tearing accross the battlefield? the answer should be no. I use two squads of scouts in my army. One five man squad with BP/CCW with a teleport homer and one squad of tactical scouts with 7 bolters, 2 sniper rifles and 1 heavy bolter. This mix gives me flexibility no matter what the scenario is I end up playing and gives me some cheap point fodder that if my opponent ignores, he can end up paying dearly for.

In fact I am thinking of moving the 5 man squad up to 8 or 10 just to keep it around a little longer to use the teleport homer more consistently...

[Viktor]

I like the idea of a 10-man squad of scouts, with basic equipment. 130 pts is nothing when you need more bodies, and they're useful since they can infiltrate and move through cover. Also, they offer variation which is very important.