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Some Rule Qs

2K views 16 replies 11 participants last post by  Tzeentch Lord 
#1 ·
hey guys im getting ready to play my first game with the new Necron Codex tomorrow and after reading the codex a couple of times i kept coming back to the same question.....how does ever-living work exactly? First off this is the rule given in the codex for ever-living: " If a model with this special rule is removed as a casualty, do not add a Reanimation Protocols counter to its unit. Instead place an Ever-living counter where the model was removed from play. At the end of the phase, roll for this counter, just as you would for a Reanimation Protocols counter....." Anyway my first question is this why do all the models that have the Ever-living rule also have the Reanimation Protocols rule if Ever-living replaces that rule? Also does Ever-living work even if the character is not in a unit? And lastly does a Res Orb work with Ever-Living because the profile of a Res-Orb says: "The bearer of the resurrection orb (and his unit) pass Reanimation Protocols rolls on a 4+." so if you take an Ever-living roll instead of a Reanimation Protocols as per the rules of Ever-living does that mean the model still needs a 5+ instead of a 4+ and the Res Orb has no effect on it? If it works that way then it would seem the Ever-living rule hurts the model more then it helps.

Also I have a question about dispersion shields the rules say: "A Lychguard with a dispersion shield has a 4+ invulnerable save. If this save is made against a shooting attack, choose an unengaged enemy unit within 6"-that unit suffers a single hit with a Strength and AP equal to that of the initial shot." My question is (and im not saying that I would) can you chose to take the 4+ invul save over your 3+ armour save so that you can redirect the shots? I checked my rule book and it wasn't very clear if you could chose which save to take or not.

Thanks Guys
 
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#2 ·
First question: Ever-Living is essentially an add-on to Reanimation Protocols, allowing character models with EL to come back to life without the usual restriction of having a unit. Basically, a character will -always- get their Reanimation Protocols roll, unless they fall victim to Sweeping Advance or something similar. Ever-Living doesn't replace Reanimation Protocols, it's an addition to it. Yes, Ever-Living works even if the character is not in a unit.

Res Orb, as far as I'm aware, would work on the model holding it, since it explicitly says it does. Otherwise you'd get problems with resolution priority in a unit with a Res Orb and, say, 5 other downed models, does the orb model get back up first thus giving everyone else a 4+? Or do they all resolve at the same time? This ruling avoids all that.

Finally, no, you cannot choose to use the 4+ save over the 3+, since in the rulebook it says (under "Saves"), that a model must always use the best save available to them.
 
#4 ·
I'm pretty sure yu can take whatever save best suits yu or the situation...the book never says yu have to use the best save(it mentions something about cover saves)I play dark eldar and when using vect or a custom archon I choose between my shadow field and ghostplate armour all the time..I don't want a bolt pistol eating up my expensive shadowfield...most people just always use the best save cause it keeps yur guys alive....
 
#7 · (Edited)
Anyway my first question is this why do all the models that have the Ever-living rule also have the Reanimation Protocols rule if Ever-living replaces that rule?
Because GW aren't that smart? Who knows

Also does Ever-living work even if the character is not in a unit?
Yes. It's essentially there to give them a chance to repair even if the unit they were with is wiped out/falls back/etc. The RP tokens are removed, but the EL ones still stick around.

And lastly does a Res Orb work with Ever-Living because the profile of a Res-Orb says: "The bearer of the resurrection orb (and his unit) pass Reanimation Protocols rolls on a 4+." so if you take an Ever-living roll instead of a Reanimation Protocols as per the rules of Ever-living does that mean the model still needs a 5+ instead of a 4+ and the Res Orb has no effect on it? If it works that way then it would seem the Ever-living rule hurts the model more then it helps.
Technically no as, like you said, EL deals with ever living tokens and specifically differentiates in the rules that it IS NOT a reanimation protocol roll. However that's probably going to be re-written in the FAQ so I'd expect that this won't be a problem in the long run.

Also I have a question about dispersion shields the rules say: "A Lychguard with a dispersion shield has a 4+ invulnerable save. If this save is made against a shooting attack, choose an unengaged enemy unit within 6"-that unit suffers a single hit with a Strength and AP equal to that of the initial shot." My question is (and im not saying that I would) can you chose to take the 4+ invul save over your 3+ armour save so that you can redirect the shots? I checked my rule book and it wasn't very clear if you could chose which save to take or not.
No, you can't choose. You must take your best roll and the rulebook specifically defines "Best Save" as the lowest value.

So the only time you get to deflect a shot is if the shooting attack is AP3 or lower.
 
#17 ·
No, you can't choose. You must take your best roll and the rulebook specifically defines "Best Save" as the lowest value.

So the only time you get to deflect a shot is if the shooting attack is AP3 or lower.
Where in the rulebook does it say a model must use it's 'best save'? Under 'Models with more than one save' (pg 24 mini rulebook) it says that 'a model only ever gets to make one saving throw, but it has the advantage of always using the best available save.' Nowhere does it say you must use the best save, only that you have the advantage of using the best one.

Also, what's to say the best save wouldn't be the dispersion shield to give you a chance of not only saving your model, but also possibly killing an enemy model in the process? Otherwise, as the OP already said, this would greatly reduce the already situational use of the dispersion shield.
 
#9 ·
So here's one I find annoying. According to the way I read the rules for Everliving, a Cryptek that has joined the 'squad' does NOT get his Everliving rule if the squad is wiped out. Ever living is pretty clear about joining the unit he was in, but that makes ever living useless to a Cryptek or basic lord in a court?
 
#10 · (Edited)
So here's one I find annoying. According to the way I read the rules for Everliving, a Cryptek that has joined the 'squad' does NOT get his Everliving rule if the squad is wiped out.
How so?


Edit: Oh! I get it. "...must be placed in coherency with the..."

No unit to be placed in coherency with so he goes *Poof*. Huh, you have a point there. Don't think that that's the way it's meant to be played, but yeah....I'll give you that one by RAW. Nice catch.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I just made a thread about the Ever Living rule before I saw this thread. But go back and re-read the rule, in the first few sentences of the 2nd paragraph, it says that they do not roll for ever living if they are part of a squad.

And as for the 2nd part of the rule, they started talking about rolling as if you had RAP, not the whole rule itself.

So basically, if they are part of a squad, they use RAP, but if they are all by themselves, they use Ever living but rolling like RAP (5+, or 4+ with orb)
 
#13 ·
Well not quite. They never make a Reanimation Protocols roll. They always make an Ever Living roll which is "as you would for a Reanimation Protocols counter...."

Paragraph One and Two aren't mutually exclusive. All the second paragraph says that if the model was joined to a unit when it was removed and it then passed it's Ever Living roll, it must be placed in coherency with the unit.

Problem is that if the unit was wiped out at the same time that the Ever-Living model was then there is no unit to be place in coherency with. So there is no legal way to place the model...so it is destroyed.

The other part just explains how to place the model if it wasn't joined to a unit when it was removed.


In either case, though, it's still and Ever-Living token, not an RP token.
 
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