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I'm sure this has been addressed more than a few times around, but after a few searches I couldn't find anything. When it comes to Righteous Smiting, is the guess range first rule thrown out in favor of the Hieratic Hierarchy?
Why I'm asking is that, with my current 1K list I'll be trying for the first time tomorrow, I was going to have the Prince babysit a unit of archers for at least the first 1-2 turns, so his My Will Be Done could potentially have some effect if not dispelled before moving into a hw/shield unit. So, if it went off, I'd be measuring the Archers range there to see if the enemy was within it. Afterwards, the LP would possibly (depending on the situation at hand, of course.) use Smiting on the SSC. Since My Will be Done comes first on the Hieratic Hierarchy.
I just wanted to be sure on how it would work before my first match, in case it comes up. Since it seems like it could be abused that way by less-than-sporting players, to even avoid a ranging shot with the SSC itself.
I have to admit that it is an interesting thought and something which I have never thought about... With the way that things go with the wording of the rules...
You technically would have to shoot with them first as they have to shoot first...
I imagine that there would be two ways to get around this without causing problems when you play. And that is by guessing the range for the SSC before you check the range of those archers...
So at least guess and write it down and then when you fire it use that range... That will at least make your opponent feel easier about eveything.
In saying that on the other hand I think you would have a valid case to argue that you should be able to measure for the archers and then guess the range for the SSC later.
When I find myself in thissort of problem I normally discuss it with my opponent first and explain my reasoning and see what they think. That way you have it all sorted before the game starts and there won't be any mid game arguing and claims of cheating.
In the end it is all about having some fun which is the most important rule.
Yeah, I'd be more likely to go with the former there. Not looking to gain an advantage from it, I was just curious as to whether there was an official ruling on it floating about somewhere that I couldn't find.
Trying to sort out and catch any problems that may arise with my current list before they do. To (theoretically) make my first games with it run a bit more smoothly.
I can understand that, some of the other armies that I play have some really interesting rules that I normally discuss with opponents before I play them to keep things running smooth.
Ironically I actually don't use SSC hence I can't really help, but its always a good thing to discuss stuff like that with opponents.
I normally run a complete Cav style army so I don't use stationary units soon though I might think about using a more defensive style list.
Hope it goes well for you tomorrow.
In the normal course of events you would have to fire the guess range weapons first. However the smiting attack is not the normal course of events. Our magic has to be cast in a particular order which overrides the rule about the order of ranged weapons being fired in.
Unless your opponent wishes to resolve every incantation before moving on to the magic induced shooting and/or movement.
Or the best bet is to just discuss it first with your opponent as has been previously suggested.
Do not question the dice gods for their wrath is swift and terrible.
Hmm. Interesting idea. Park a 10 man archer unit with a Prince/King in it and put a SSC right next to that with a Liche nearby. Your opponent may not care if the King casts Smite on the archers as they're not well known for doing a lot of damage. This allows you to measure 24" for the archers, and then guess super accurately with the SSC if it recieves a Smite, or in the shooting phase.
Well done dude!
so in magic phase of TK, according to Hieratic Hierarchy first declare incantations then solve the results or the King/Prince's incantation will solve then pirest casts and his/her incantation will solve...
Its perfectly legal, and one of the great advantages of the spell Although with the archers, you should just measure 24" from the and check what's in range, you shouldn't hold the measure there for long in order to gain an advantage. But by quick judgement you can use the archer range to judge the SSC shot a little better. And then of course, get one bang on in the shooting phase
And yep, Vace, all incantation effects are immediate and follow the course of the normal phase they are done in (So for Ex, Urgency to declare a charge, the charge follows all the normal rules as if it was happening in the movement phase) Once the Charge is complete, you may continue with your casting.
Also note, any panic check caused by the SSC is immediate too. Only 25% casualties is an end of phase panic check. So SSC panic is also resolved mid phase.
i would suggest putting the liche priest on the SSC to keep him out of an archer target. i find my liche priest becomes a pincusion after the first couple of turns out of a unit. then again i play a gun heavy emipre player.
Based on the above issues i find the best place for Liches is behind slow infantry blocks, (a hierarch with the cloak of the dunes or on a mount can use our faster units for cover) against any armies that lack the following:
- Good opponents know that without Liches the TK army doesnt function so they are usually primary targets!!!
- If the enemy ranged units have LOS to your Liches, they will die very quickly to massed fire even with a ward save.
- The ranged magic missile incantation that the Liches possess is the poorest of their four incantations, so therefore it should not be cast except in the direst need and as a consequence you do not need to have LOS to enemy units.
- Liches need to be in close proximity to the units their incantations will augment but they do not require LOS.
- Liches are very vulnerable in the front rank of a unit when engaged in combat!
- Liches are very vulnerable when out of units to non LOS damage spells i.e Uranons thunderbolt etc.
- Lone Liches are very vulnerable to sneaky scouts and flyers
Your best defence against these units/tactics is sensible movement and maintaining awareness of your opponents tools. If an opponent possesses multiple units that fall into the above categories its best to place your liches in your units as they offer them the best protection from missiles, magical or otherwise.
- Scouts/Fast units with first turn charge or shooting capability: Wood Elf Scouts, Waywatchers, Warhawk Riders and Skaven tunnelling teams.
- Large flying monsters can target and charge any unit within range that they can see, so long as they can land(exploit this by placing Liches very close to interposing units to prevent said beasty landing!)
- Elevated shooting units on hills are generally allowed to target anything on a lower level than they, including individual models.
- Mages possessing area effect or non LOS spells should be carefully monitored! (I have played a game back in the distant past when one Comet of Cassondora killed all three of my Liche Priests in a 2k force resulting in a massacre for my opponent)
- Guess range warmachines (stone throwers and cannons in particular) can also send a Liche Priest on a one way trip to oblivion
Of course there is a downside to this tactic, once in combat a mage is a tasty target for any opponent, even rank and file troops will kick the crap out of the ol' bag of bones. The best tactic is to put him in a unit that can charge and cause significant casualties on the first turn to prevent him being hit back. This is hard to achieve with our infantry but a Tomb Prince or King in the adjacent file can act as a strong bodyguard! If your opponent is foolish enough to issue a challenge i would advise you to retreat the mage!!!
An honourable mention must go to the item that robs an enemy model of an attack in base combat, it is kind of a last resort but if you are struggling it may increase the survivability of said priest against the odd low level attack.
How do you expect to defeat me when I am forever and you are just a man...