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By all means this is just my humble opinion but i have seen so many places ppl saying take 3+ chariots that i think it deserves some thought. 3 points
Point 1: Chariots without a character suck and can break almost nothing on charge
Point 2: Chariots go with a fast attacking army not a defensive army
Point 3: YOU NEED 5 chariots to take that very important look out sir
Point 4: A chariot unit with a character can break anything, i repeat anything in Warhammer fantasy (Especialy with a lord and flail of sculls )
The counter points, of course, are that it still only takes a couple of s7 hits or a cannonball and your massive unit is now close to dead. With 6 models (5 + character) you aren't even going to get all of them in BTB contact to attack. Probably 4 maximum would be touching. That many chariots across is a massive front so they are quite unweildy and hard to manouvre.
3 and a character will bust most units on the charge if you roll decently. 4 on their own will work great as a support unit to help the rest of your army and aim for flanks since they get a free reform. Any more and they do become a bit of a burden to manage and very wide IMO.
Its ineteresting looking at the points that you have put out there when it comes to chariots...
I normally run units of 4 no smaller and no larger... this is for the simple fact that when you start running them in units of 3 they don't seem to do enough. When you have a unit of 4 generally all of them will get their impact hits into units even in units that are on 20mm bases. Combine this with the fact that most units are 20-25 and when you combine impact hits and the 4 attacks that each chariot will have there is a good chance that you will win combat and outnumber...
I also noticed that you pointed out the "look out sir" rule and needing 5 standard chariots to benefit from this. that being said if you are throwing characters into a chariot chances are you are going for the offensive chariot list and if used right you will at worst be getting off a second turn charge and generally its not easy for people to pick out your characters.
Generally you will find that when people are using chariots in their defensive lists they are used as a flanking unit... if this is the case then all you really need are three chariots though as you need a unit strength of 5 to cancel rank bonuses.
I guess I am ranting a little here and if I come across as being harsh I am sorry, I guess its because I have been running Tomb King chariot lists for so long I've come to learn a lot about them.
There is nothing more annoying when your Wyches with Plasma Grenades get "Always strikes First" for their combat drugs!
if you go 5 wide though, most of the time the unit will be far to wide and cumbersome and not all the chariots will get into base to base.
I think it also depends on playstyle, It seems to me that you use them offensively and also take them head to head against enemy units. If thats the case then yes, you need bigger units.
In my list I have a defensive army with two units of 3, their job is not to fight units on their own. They are a reactionary force on my flanks that are there to support my other units with flank charges and rank negation. I also dont run my lord on a chariot so I have no need of large chariot units to protect him.
So in your list 5 might work, but in a good many lists it is uneccesary/inefficient to use units that big.
"I am the architect of fate!"
If i had more points available, id consider running 4, but as it stands i use 2 units of 3 in my 1K list. Chariots arent meant for crashing into the front of a unit of 30 skellies or whatever, their small unit size, Fast Cav rule and speed mean they are great for flank tasks, be it protection or taking out small units etc. £ strong do fine for me.
If i used 5, id have to add a Character, and then in order for the unit to be manouverable enough they would have to be ranked 3x2, meaning 3 of the chariots are wasted.. overall i just dont see the benefit of a 500pt cannonball target.
This works the only problem is a Dwarf gunline with the anvil that is the only army that i ahve lots of difficulty beating
And yes obviously im taking about offensive i have also skaven with which i play defensive so TK i play offensive
Last edited by Ereius; August 29th, 2008 at 12:25.
That is, assuming your magic is good enough ofcourse. And when you speak of that breaking anything (3D3 hits + 4A), what is covered by that? The reason i dont like running a Character in Chariot is that i reallky never found it cost effective. Any enemy unit with a decent fighting character, any unit with a good static res (3 ranks + banner + ounum) and thing with a decent T or Sv, and unbreakable unit, tends to nullify a chariot charge pretty easily. First thing i learned about TK, never charge a ranked unit head on with Chariots...
I really think anything larger than 4 is way too unweildy and difficult to manouvre and they don't all get into BtB, but if it works for you then go for it. People should try both ways.
I was sceptical of the two units of three for a long time but they have a few advantages. As a flanking unit they only need a couple to negate ranks and you have a fairly good chance of winning a combat with just two chariots in the flank, assuming a character is not on the corner that is.
If a unit of three takes a casualty you can still execute a dual charge with both units to the same effect that a unit of 4 or even 5 would, combining three chariots, or even two with a scorpion can win you a front on combat if you pick your battles. There is also a chance you may outnumber with fear with two chariot units which can make all the difference.
One larger units presents an obvious threat and will attract alot of attention, whereas two smaller units can be harder to wipe out or counter due to their seperate movement. One small unit is also quite expendable for when you need to pin an enemy unit in place for a turn.
I have not been playing tomb kings for too long now, but i did realize something, chariots cost alot of points, especially in a small army say 1000- 3000 pt, i would consider the five wide under two conditons.
1)if taking five chariots in one unit will not be up to 20+% of my army
2) if i think that such a wide rank would be more effective than 4 chariots (3 rand and file and a character)
i guess it would be better in larger games, and armies that run wide fronts (goblins for one) other than that i figure its not worth it, unless you really banking on the fear break because of outnumbering.
Guns kill, but pens are just as effective. Never thought of that have you?