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Hi there, my army is the tomb kings and my bug bear is vampire counts. I played against them before and got whipped out. So what do i need to beet the vampire counts them selves or what magic item do i need to stand a chance? Can any one advise me on the matter. your sincerely, question
Hey, welcome to LO. Please be sure to check your capitals and full stops and spellings in future posts. Just a friendly notice, nothing to worry about Thanks, Phoenix.
Last edited by Phoenix; June 21st, 2009 at 12:18.
Oh, guess I can help you
VC lacks in shooting. Make this to your advantage! Use SSCs and Skellie Bowmen.
Your magic is safe, His magic is very risky. If he tries to cast the Big-Bad-Spells such as the Winds of Undeath or Summon Undead Horde, just make sure you got some Dispel Scrolls. It can shut down the whole Magic Phase for him.
Use the Casket Not many units in the VC Tier got high Ld. You can take off several regiments by this way, or ensure that your own magic will work via letting him dispel he Casket. If he doesn't dispel it, he will have to spend ALOT of magic to resummon his armies. If he do want to dispel it, he have to pay 2 DD to be around 55 percent sure or 3DD to be absolutely safe, except from the Big-Bad-Luck
Do not play with Chariots... sadly they will not work that well. They will charge in, kill some models and then be stuck 'cause VC will NOT flee.
Watch out for Ethereal! You will fall victim by most of the units, and they will most likely start to hunt your Hierophant. For this cause, field a LP with SoR.
Hope It Helps!
I would suggest getting many Tomb Scorpians and lots of magic to move them around. The low quality troops of the VC will no be able to hurt them and his Vampires can't afford to be in combat with them.
With magic enough to move them around you should aim to get them to the enemies Vampire Lord.
Casket is definitely a good idea. Most of the VC army has pitiful LD, for example Varghulfs with their LD of 4. The only thing in the VC army with LD above 7 is the Lord (who has LD 10).
hell either try his luck and keep them in the unit or take them out where your ssc and bowmen can snipe them. the basic vamps are T4, so youll prob need a lot of shots, but its worth it.
i second the casket. any army that has ld4/5 units deserve to have their souls eaten
I forgot to tell, VC is my second Army... So I can really assure that this information is correct I have written the Nightmare for myself, challenging my head Army TK with VC Make use of the insider info, hehe
Nagash's advice is good, but just bear in mind that VCs are one of the real pain-in-the-rear match ups for TKs, lots of ItP numbers to get through, and we find that tough to do, So don't be too disheartened if even the best laid plans dont work!
Spam casting will be your worst nightmare...
When the VC general needs it they can bring 7+ raises a turn with general ease. Compared to your 2-3 Raises, minus the banner if you take it, it will make you wan't to rip your hair out.
Sure, they don't have shooting but it takes true numbers of shots to take off their ranks and if you build your army to approach that angle then you will probably do just enough wounds for him to hit you with equal sized blocks of troops. however, if you don't shoot then you will be looking at a serious uphill battle with combat res you won't be able to compete against.
Catapults are good if you can get hits, the Casket is devastating, assuming they let it go off, and Skeleton Archers (Banner and Champ) will be your workhorses. I always put champs in my skellies when I fight my friends VC so I can challenge and remove his Vamp from combat saving me at least a few skeletons which lets me stay in the fight a bit longer.
Scorpions are awesome without doubt but against an experienced VC general you won't have the room to charge his general. You might be able to get some of his support characters thought. One of the first to go for is the BSB in the Graveguard unit if he went that route. Getting rid of Regen on that unit will be key to thinning their numbers adequately.
Chariots do ok versus VC but chariots are balanced around the idea of crushing units that they hit. They are only good on the charge so WHEN they get stuck, not if versus VC, they becomes an expensive burden to keep alive when your very few Summonings should probably be used elsewhere.
Blocks of Infantry are key imho. When facing VC I never bring less than 4. 2-Blocks of Skellie Archers (sometimes the 3rd is HW and Shield to be a true anvil) and Tomb Guard with Icon of Rakaph. The free reform gives you the mobility you NEED to deny your opponent their static combat res by way of flanks, and it is also handy when you have to deal with Vargulfs running up your flanks that your more conventional methods failed to stop. It is also great to deal with those summoned zombie units that will deny you your static combat res. It is for the reason of mobility that I choose Tomb Guard over Ushabti in this situation.
I used to play against VC once a week until he switched back to Skaven. If he took his competative lists I couldn't touch him. But here's what worked and what didn't:
The Casket makes a huge difference to his casting phase, Normally he could use 1d6 to cast a rez, but the +1 makes it chancey so if he really wants the models back he'll need to spend 2 dice.
Tunnelling is usually not worth it as he has no artillery and characters are usually burried in ranked units marching toward you.
Carrion march blocking is very effective since you want to shoot him as long as possible, and also hope for a lucky casket going off.
Some units that I've found very tough to deal with (and in fact usually can do nothing about unless I get very lucky):
Dragon Mounted Lord with flaming spear, hatred and each wound generates another attack. He has something like 6 S7 attacks rerolling misses, so usualoly 5 hits, wounding on 2+ each wound generates another attack.
Nightmare Mounted Lord with hatred, Book of Arcan (bound Dance), Mounted BSB with a nasty banner, 7 Knights.
I'm not sure about the rest of you but my regular VC opponent seldom has less than 10 dice in his casting pool and takes an item that lets him transfer one to his dispel pool, so he usually has 7 or 8 dispel dice plus scrolls. The only thing that limits that on my side is the Casket and possibly a Staff for +1 to dispel (which helps against bound items and rez attempts).
Last edited by medic_4077; June 30th, 2009 at 16:27.
War Record Since Sept 2005
Old Codex 48-20-9 Dark Eldar
New Codex 1-0-0 Dark Eldar