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Im playing a 2v2 game with friends and my enemies are Wood Elves and Ogres. My ally are the Dwarfs. Anywho since the dwarves are slow and typically wait for the action to come to them i was thinking of having an equally slow army.
I am currently torn between either going with a TK or LHP. I need magic, but i know that since im the only one with magic that i would be dispelled/scrolled a lot. But if i dont go magic ill get stomped by magic and there fast moving units. SO which do YOU think is the wiser way to go?
I also though of taking a queen so i can get some unchallenged catapult shots in.
Ideas of any type are welcomed for defeating fast/hard hitting armies.
To this sort of battle I would recommend:
Hope It Helps!
- Khalida if she's an available option... Otherwise, field a LHP (not often I say that since I usually uses the TK)
- Boost Skellie Bowmen You will always hit on 5s, no matter where those WE bastards hide in the forest.
- Go for a Casket! Yaaaaaay
- And a SSC
- Yeah, as you can see: Go for a shooty list with Magic included... Hit Enemy Wizards with Scorps
A Khalida/Dwarf gunline?!? Ouch! That's gotta hurt!
A few random thoughts about magic:
Since they're going to have to come towards you the casket of souls would be very nice. In a big game like this the -1 on casting is far more valuable than it generally is in smaller battles. Although they will almost certainly move heaven and earth to make sure it doesn't go off, that's fine because it will soak up a dispel scroll or (probably) 3 or 4 dispel dice per turn.
Enkhils Kanopi is the bargain of the century here at only 20pts. Your opponents will be forced to choose between losing all that lovely Ogre gut magic or throwing away yet more dispel dice at it. Either way, it's a win-win scenario for you and a lose-lose proposition for them.
You don't say what points limit you're using, but if you have plenty of points to play with then the (normally far too expensive) staff of sorcery is actually well worth considering. At -1 to cast from the casket and a +1 to dispel for you will give them brain cramps and serious pause for thought when it comes to deciding how many dice they will have to throw at their spells. -you may begin to see a pattern developing here.
Now for semething really controversial: Seriously consider taking the Standard of the sands. IF you're playing a high enough points limit then you should be able to field enough priests to offset the disadvantage of using the poor old icon bearer. Even if you aren't, the ability to march block everything on their side of the board simply cannot be underestimated if you're going with a gunline strategy. It will also keep them near their own edge of the board for any rally checks they have to make thanks to your SSC(s) and Khalidas uncounterable smite. The standards -1 to rally checks will make it that much harder for for them to do this reliably before things start fleeing off the table. At the very least, the standard will give you another turn of shooting and slow their advance down to a crawl until your ICFB units turn up and keep them march blocked.
And a couple of ideas on general strategy:
Take several 5 man light cav units for march blocking and redirecting purposes. As an added bonus they die nice and quick (leaving their fast units unengaged and badly out of position when your horrific shooting phase comes round again). Any half decent opponent will know exactly what you're up to, but if you position them right there's not a whole lot they can do about it.
And finally, nobody can refuse a flank the way a dwarf army can. Trouble is, they aren't anything like fast enough to be able to fully capitalise on the advantage under normal circumstances. If only they had a friendly bunch of chariots to pummel the other flank and swing around behind eh?
Generally there is an awful lot of synergy between the dwarves and TK. Their anvil units are top notch so don't waste lots of points on inferior meelee skellies/tomb guard. TK chariots will give you the kind of mobility and reach their hammer units can only dream of (don't be in too much of a hurry to rush these across the board though, let them come to you and whittle down their ranks with your poison arrows to the point where a successful break on the charge is all but a foregone conclusion).
That'll learn 'em.
Because Sun Tzu would play Tomb Kings...
Ok so my friend and I met up to strategize, but we didnt get anywhere. I don't see any magic getting through for since its my magic versus two armies dispell dice. Also going mobile will be costly since i WONT get magic through ill be moving at a slow pace of 4'' or 8''....And for my dwarf friends they would need an anvil to really move forward. I feel that Im totally stuck with a "mow them down" before they reach you situation.
Its a 2k per army game to 4k a side. The info on the march blocking banner is a great idea IMO. But for a plan i cant come up with anything decent. I thought of khalida in 19x Tomb guard with full command and Rakaph. Then 4 units of 20 poison archers, 2 SSC, and LP with cloak/jar...roughly.
Also to help i know my friends were thinking of Treeman ancient and a "deathstar" which is like 1000points of ogres in one unit(immune to psych). I dunno i need more ideas....
Thanks for the help so far.
I guess your friends have figured that out too... That you will not be able to get off any spells since they are two against one
If they have figured it out, they will most likely not focus Dispelling at all (not that I know your friends, but it sounds reasonable), and a Magic Oriented TK Army will make them Crazy... I mean build up a 13 PD Army + Bound Spells and they will have to dispel with around 6DD each (If they go one lvl3-4 and two lvl1-2) - that leaves room for the Bound Spells!
Your opponent will not be able to dispel your Incantations unless you've prepared them for a Magic Heavy TK List (DON'T ), since they think you will put the focus elsewhere
This is exactly what those five man units of light cav are for. If you position them carefully (usually in front and angled away from the direction the deathstar wants to move in) then your opponents will be forced to deal them and waste the best part of the game dealing 70 point units worth of horsies.
Since all those Ogres will be on such nice big bases and take up such a lot of ground you should have no trouble beasting them with (multiple) SSC shots. Poison arrows from all those archers will further whittle down their numbers to a more manageable level.
If the deathstar does make it across to your lines then I would defiantely give your dwarven allies the 'honour' of taking them on. Our meelee boys are really not cut out for that kind of abuse unless we can break them with fear (wich you obviously can't).
Nagash was spot on with his post. They wont be expecting much from you in the magic phase so don't be afraid to lay it on good and thick here. If you're already leaning towards taking Khalida then remember her Venom staff will leave that 1000 point 'deathstar' looking decidedly more 'crapstar'. Obviously, this will immediately get added to their list of "things we must dispel", but that list is already getting pretty long (even before you take the 'must dispel' urgency spells into account). At power level 5 the staff will eat up another 2 of their dispel dice every turn. By the time you add in other bound items like the casket, Botul, Kanopi, SoRav etc, they will have little or nothing left for your spells. They can't stop everything.
Because Sun Tzu would play Tomb Kings...
Let the Dwarves do the close combat killing
Focus on flank charges when it comes to your combat
... And you will be more than fine The TK+D combo is almost unmatchable if played in the right way - They cover the weaknesses for each others with their own Strengths, and still have the option of a great syncronized game played, hehe
Well, a single decent SSC shot can bring a Treeman down with easy. D6=3+ wounds and its dead. Flaming doubles wounds, Stone Thrower denys armour, and Magic denys Ward saves
The "DeathStar"... your Dwarf friend should have cannons. Aim, fire, sit back and chill
Careful if you use Khalida. Especially if your Dwarf mate is using a big expensive Character too. Facing Ogres it shouldn't be too bad, but if you have lots of points in one place, it will reduce your numbers... and Wood ELves will really be able to take advantage there with lots of small fast units harassing you from everywhere.