Welcome to Librarium Online!
Join our community of 80,000+ members and take part in the number one resource for Warhammer and Warhammer 40K discussion!
Registering gives you full access to take part in discussions, upload pictures, contact other members and search everything!
Master of the Black Arts
Talisman of the Lycni
So I have a question for you all, and on a topic I've never liked.
I'm playing in a campaign soon and it's been brought to my attention that my list might be a little "Beardy/Cheese/whatever whiny people are calling it"
Now, I've always been of the mentality that GW, while very capable of making mistakes, still puts a lot of effort into their army books and making them balanced; or at least as balanced as possible. This is what bothers me about people thinking they themselves are better suited to decide what handicaps a specific army should have.
It was recently brought to my attention that often in tournaments certain tier 1 armies get fewer points then the rest of the competitors (notably VC, DE, and DoC). While I won't go into the specifics as to my feelings on this, I will say they aren't very approving.
Now, I've been told one of the reasons for this with VC is the invocation spamming that happens. Which is kind of the reason I was going to play VC in the first place. I like the idea of being able to reraise my fallen troops, they're undead so I had to raise them in the first place anyway right? And if I could raise an entire army I must be pretty proficient at it as well.
The real problem they're having is that I may be putting too much attention on it. It's an escalation campaign and we're making 250pt increments. My 500pt has two Vampires with the Dark Acolyte power for a total of 6PD, and my 750 adds a third vampire with Master of the Black Arts for a total of 9PD.
I'm being told that even an army at 2000pts with 9PD is considered at least a little unfair and with any more than that they could even ask you to reappraise your list to be able to enter.
Basically I suppose the actual question here is that they wanted me to ask you, the people of LO, if 9PD in 750 is too overpowered
i also have a hard time understanding just why the VC's recieve the bulk of the hate - especially when dark elves & daemons are far more abusable than vampires!!! plus, neither of those armies has the brutal handicap of 'your general dies = your army falls apart.'
on the surface, even high elves will struggle to contain 9PD at only 750pts. but here's where your list suffers; 3 of those dice can be used to increase the ghouls above their starting unit size. also, those 3 dice are on a Lv1 wizard, who will have invo + 1 opther random spell... he's not a huge threat at all, since most of our spells have a fairly high casting value. (it's 50/50 wether he can even get vanhel's off for example!)
of corse, at only 750pts, you are likely to walk all over most armies, since it's only really the high elves, dwarves & lizzies who can spam alot of DD at this pts level... but then, most things in the game fight better than undead, so armies like daemons, dark elves, warriors, beasts and such will still beat your face in!
besides, if your opponent is thinking at all, then instead of saving up his dice for dispelling potential magic missiles and such, he should be trying to stop as many of your invos as possible... granted it's a bit difficult if you roll alot of 5's/6's since the summon ghoul vamps have a +1 to cast, but it's still do-able.
also when it somes to combat, TARGET THE BLOODY VAMPIRE!!! it boggles my mind just how often opponent's simply try and kill your troops instead of directing the attacks of the 2-3 models in contact with your vamp...
as for the list itself, i'd drop the MotBA's vamp for now, grab the book of arkhan and try and fit say a unit of 5 or so black knights in to give you some speed, plus a solid flanking unit! 6 PD is still quite a magic phase in any game of 1000pts or less...
right now your army is very slow and has only 2 targets! thus you're very prone to being easily out-manouvered by almost everyone! plus, the added speed will help against missile heavy armies since your knights can move through cover with ease, and then charge out of forests into the gunline!
you could also drop the summon ghouls of the second vamp for the age old acolyte/avatar w/great weapon set-up... use him first as a 'bait mage', throwing out say a magic missile or else a casting of vanhel's and then start your summoning?!
just a few ideas to liven up on the fairly bland 'i cast invocation 8 times each turn' style army?!
my two main armies are vampire and tzeentch demons, so i think you can never have too many power dice!!
but i agree with 626 on this one, drop the top vamp, give the hauberk to the vamp with no armor, leaving you 175 points, if you really want to scare people take 3 cairn wraiths one of which is a tomb banshee, at this many points very few people have magic weapons, you cant spam raise em so ppl cant complain about that, but conversly 4 dispel dice should stop most magic at 750 pts, and 6 power dice is enouh to get past most armies at this level (again dwarves are gunne be the bigeest pain)
check the tournement rules before entering, if you see army specific hate... dont enter. the only army hating rule i ever agreed with was in a 2k tournement the dark elf pendant of kaleth counted as a hero choice if you took it (but the item is ridiculous on a lord)
i hope this helps