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It has been awhile since I posted here. Been on a break from Warhammer because of WoW/School. I'm back now , so this is a list I made to fight against magic heavy High Elves, and to my surprise I got a massacre. Let me know if I actually made a good list or if it was just a bad night for him. Thanks again, and its good to be back.
Lvl 2, Ring of Night, Heart Piercing, Master Strike, and shield.
Lvl 2 and Power Familiar
Lvl 2 and Staff of Damnation
barded Nightmare, lance, heavy armour, shield, and Wailing Terror
152 pts. (This guy was a last minute add-on. I wanted to add someone to the Black Knights for hitting power but didnt want to take my general away from the slow units. The funny thing is this guy and his unit never saw action! Too bad, I can only dream of the carnage that could have happened)
spears, light armour, and FC
300 pts. (The reason this unit was so expensive was because it was also a last minute change and I didnt know how to spend the rest of my points, so I added the spears since the elves were faster and most likely get the charge.)
2 units of 30 Zombies
3 units of 10 Dire Wolves
Black Knights: 5
barding and FCw/ Banner of the Barrows
Total: 1965 pts.
I know it seemed like too many points open, but I had no idea what to do to spend it. Didn't matter anyway.
To the army list forum with thee, o vile spawn of discussion forum!
Having an army and not owning a rulebook is like owning a car with no steering wheel.Originally Posted by amishcellphone
I really don't have a lot to add mainly because I really don't see any big holes in it. It's the kind of list I would run and expect to win with.
I'd drop the standards on the zombie units since you're more likely to give them away as VPs than anything else. You don't really expect to win combat with zombies on their own. You expect to hold up units until you can flank/rear charge them and win through numbers anf fear.
With those extra points, you're within 5 points of having three fell bats, which I think would add a lot, really complement the wolves. Just drop a zombie to add them, especially since you're going to displace a zombie anyhow with a character.
The bats will add a 4th long range unit to deal with warmachines, mages, skirmishers, marchblocking, and so on. And unlike wolves, they can't be marchblocked themselves.
I would suggest that you change the thrall to a wight lord with an enchanted shield and the sword of kings. This would save you 40pts and allow you the 4 fell bats David suggested.
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If you have the extra points buy dispel scrolls! They always help you out in a jam. Personally I would rather take a book of arkhan over the power familiar and then have 25 more points to spend on other things. Another spell that you can use is better than one more power dice and one dispel dice. Hell you can take a dispel scroll and the book for the same cost and be sure to get your points worth over the familiar. They are guaranteed to do exactly what you want at least twice (should you roll the terrible 1 on your first use of the book), which is better than a few maybes anyday. And I will say it again as I have said it to people many times before....why are you taking full commands? For example what is the skeleton captain doing? he costs more than another skeleton...and for what? An extra attack? Another body is almost always better. The musicians don't help either, they bolster the morale of your units that will never flee. With the points you save you might be able to squeeze in something else. I don't know if I would put the thrall in with the knights...ok I might just cause I am like you, that is a really big hurting unit. I am afraid, however, that it might be putting to many eggs in one basket. Like you said they might never see combat so he wont make up his points and what if they all get whiped out? I find that the knights usually have enough hitting power on their own when used properly. With your list the way it is there really isn't anywhere else to put him. Try him there a few more times and let me know how it goes, it definately could be a world of hurt.
Last edited by frozencore; December 1st, 2006 at 00:25.
Thanks for the advice everyone, now allow me to make some points.
I really don't see why you wouldn't take FC with undead. To me they are actually more important than those in other armies because of what they can do. Let me explain.........
Captain: He is very important to me for one reason and 1 reason alone: protection. My necromancer went with that unit and I did go up against a character or a challenge. I was glad I took that champion to accept the challenge. I'll sacrifice 10 points for over 100 any day.
Standard Bearer/Musician: I took these not for their ability to help the morale, but for combat resolution. If I learned anything from VC, its that great fact of life: Skellies and Zombies suck in combat! I got a flank charge with my dire wolves against spearelves fighting my unit of zombies. Now, I was happy with that because I thought he was gonna run for sure. I cause 4 wounds from my wolves and 0 with my zombies, while he caused 3 wounds with his unit. If I didn't take the SB/Musician, it would have been in a tie and I would have been in another long round of combat that didn't look my way. Thankfully, he didn't get the +1 CR for SB since I had one. He ran and I caught him.
In conclusion, when you look at the obvious uses for them, I will look for ways that benefit me having them. :yes: BTW I will keep trying the thrall idea, but I might do what Gingerninja sugested.
DavidVC04: I was trying to do that, but I didn't think 3 would cut it, so I didn't add them. Thanks for the way to get room though.
Gingerninja: That is a good idea. I haven't thought of that. Thanks and I'll give ya some rep.
I didn't say anything about the standard bearer, he is always worth it. The musician's best trait is the +1 leadership to rally. That just doesn't do much anything when you never have to flee...fine breaking ties...but still, it might not save you a whole lot of points but every point you save can be used to buy that new shiny magic item. The champions are the big place to save points. For you it won't matter so much since you only have 2 commands to skimp on, but some people have 4 or more and those points can tend to add up. Secondly, unless the rules have changed since the last time I checked challenges can only be accepted by "characters", and champions of units are not characters...look it up. Anyway you could just not accept...Invocation doesnt require line of sight...
Also, if you were flanking him you get a +1 to your CR and he would loose his rank bonus so your superior tactics should have owned him anyway.
Last edited by frozencore; December 1st, 2006 at 08:29.
Yeah, I think there are good arguments both ways. Some people don't take musicians on undead because the enemy almost always has a musician. So you rarely win ties by taking one. Plus if you do lose due to not having a musician, it only means that you lose 1 zombie/skeleton.
Myself, I usually take a musician but not always a standard. Undead troops, at least core ones, can be mowed down pretty easily. I hate to give up VPs where there's really no need.
A champion is allowed to make and accept challenges.
The reason I take FC is because I cannot trust my zombies/skellies to make it with just themselves. To me, they need to get as many CR points as they can. Its just a preference to me.
Yeah, having that champion can mean life and death for a necromancer. Or would that be unlife and death? Or life and undeath? Or ....
Anyhow, skellies usually get a FC from me. Zombies, maybe not, just depends.