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I've played half a dozen games with the new VC rules and I gotta say the Blood Knights are by no means overrated. Sure they're expensive, yeah cannons can blow them to bits, and yes Frenzy can be annoying, but the punch these chaps pack has to be one of the biggest.
I started off being very sceptical about the Blood Knights for the reasons about. A unit of 5 with full command is 325 points to start. But, wanting to know if they could live up to their as yet unproved reputation of killiness I was gouded into using them, and I've got to say they're performed in every game thus far doing more than their points cost every time. They've killed Dragons, Stanks, Black Orcs, Chaos Knights and more with all but the Stank getting the charge. This is not to say they are a blunt weapon and should be thrown straight into it without forethought. So I've made sure the following are done when using the knights;
- Give the Kastellan the Bale Fire Spike. Yeah I know he already comes with a Lance, but the Magic lance makes the unit more versatile for when facing armies with Daemonic Ward Saves and creatures with Regeneration (Like Treemen)
- Banner of Ward Save Vs Shooting. Yeah it's more points but boy does it pay for itself!
- BSB with Drakenhof Banner. Well, if you're going to take the Knights you want to make sure they do their job and can take the charge from the toughest of Opponents.
- Plenty of Magic. I've found that if I'm taking Blood Knights, this eliminates the need for a fighty lord and instead concentrate 3 characters on the Magic side of things as this a) makes the army more diverse for fighting different styles of armies b) helps prevent the Knights falling prey to horrible spells (especially the Beast Cowers!). It also means you have a Lord with lots of Power Dice to raise more Knights!
- Dire Wolves are your friends! If you're playing an army that looks like forcing your charge, use the Wolves to block it either side of the Knights. They're also good for holding up Dragons.
- Finally, I rush mine straight up the middle. Yes I did say they're not just a blunt instrument, but with the correct preparation they will take whatever is thrown at them and keep smiling.
So how do you use yours?
Unit of 4 (Banner + Kastellan), used as a flanking unit with Dire Wolf support. Still plenty of killing ability, and capable of breaking anything but elite infantry on the charge but with a slightly more reasonable points cost.
The only game I played against them was with Dwarves, I trashed them by using a unit of Quarrellers to draw the charge and flee and then hitting them with IronBreakers in the flank (hidden from Knights by terrain). I see this kind of play being common against big units of Blood Knights, and at 300+ points they are a lot of points to risk doing somethign stupid.
Hey Steve, its Matt from Epsom. Just to let you know, after reading the VC Blood Knight rules, they are of course completely disgusting, but there is more!!!!. If you look at their special rules it states that they are each "Vampires", referencing to page 35 i think, if you look at this page it says ALL Vampire are level 1 wizards and have the ability to cast invocation of nehek. So technically, in a unit of 5 blood knights, they will generate 5 power and dispell dice, but will each be able to cast invocation if another member in their unit dies.
Not bad ehh??
Last edited by smurfboi; February 28th, 2008 at 19:25.
One by one the penguin's steal my sanity!
I think that they are units for 3000+ points games when you can buy bigger unit cca 6 members with full command, regeneration banner, and join them vampire with blood drinker to heal them and another unit of black knight to screen them. In smaller games are black knights better. In smaller games 5 members unit cost protection simply too much in comparation of unit size and you pay lot of points to protect one blood knight unit member.
I personally don't really like the Blood Knights in less then 3k. I would rather take the greater number of Black Knights(I try to boost them with Helm Of Command), and have the added control over them, along with the ability to ignore terrain. At 3k, however, a unit of 5 Blood Knights lead by a CC tooled Vamp Lord is great to have around.
I'm Solid Snake...also, I'm a Primarch.
My local store is using a list at the moment based around a single unit of blood knights and its prooving imposible to beat as of yet. it is scedualed to take on a Teclis army this week but I dont think it will beat the vampire list. It looks like this...
Count Manfred =600
staff of damnation,
Vampire = 190
master of the black arts,
(in a skeleton unit)
Vampire = 200
master of the black arts,
Septor de noirat,
(in Skeleton unit)
6 Blood Knights = 470
sword of might (Kastellen),
flag of blood keep,
10 Skeletons = ##
10 Skeletons = ##
20 Zombies = ##
power dice = 13 up to 18
dispel dice = 7 up to 12 + 2 scrolls
The way it works is the two spell caster vamps use the skeleton units as a living ward sucking up missile dammage and stopping them from being picked out, whilst at the same time using there magic to raise and heal units to march block or bulk units up, presenting a no realistic threat as they are there for show and keeping the rest of the army standing whilst the BK do all the work.
The Bk trounce about the tabletop with a 2+ armour save, 4+ ward against "any ranged attack", topped off with a 4+ regeneration save. And even then if one or more dies they are easily brought back in the next magic phase. As for combat they are as expected nails. at strength 5 basic they can and have been taking charges and winning, sat also on a standing 3 combat res before they kill anything, and a Kastellen with S6 with 4 attacks able to take challenges no problem.
The only way to get rid of this unit short of getting two full charges from steam tanks (doesnt always work!), is ; a) kill all the blood knights in combat so that they can not be raised back.
b) by magic (enter Teclis and law of metal) destroy the magical items giving them the deffence .
c) get the change on the blood knights and try to get killing blow on Manfred, as he doesnt get his amour save or regeneration against it.
Other than this no average or normal army has the capability to do enough to take out that unit, whilst at the same time it can happily munch through opponents.
As the army goes it seems a little boring to play from what i've seen with all casting going into raising and ocaisionaly movment, but if Bk are to be the center of the army and you want a solid list then this is certainly it.
I think that this army depednds on oponents army, if he has units to counter this or not. Best tactics against this army is not fight bloodknights and used their frenzy against them=flayers, fast cavalery etc. I think thats against blood knights generally and depends not if in unit are vampires or not.
The way i see it you cant just ignore the unit because it is such a huge chunk of the army that you wont win unless you do some damage to it. And people say that all you have to do is use their frenzy against them and bait and flee, but in reality its not that simple the vampire player knows that's what you will try to do, and try to make it as hard as possible.
BEN DIESEL FTW!!!