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Hi, So Im an empire player but Im having a lot of trouble with a new player at our shop who plays vampire counts and i figured, what better place to get advice on how to deal with them than go right to the source, YOU GUYS!
Generally i dont have THAT much problem with most of his army, its pretty standard and genearlly i can fair pretty well against skellies, coaches and even the vargulf....
the problem for me is he has a unit that seems to be unkillable. Its a unit of 20 grave guard along with a wight lord with the banner that gives the whole unit regeneration (drakenhoff?) In addition he throws in his vampire lord which is a level 4 wizard with the blood hauberk so he has a 5+ ward. So i end up facing a unit that has high armor and regeneration, and a character that has a T5, 5+ ward save, 4+ regeneration save, and 3+ armor save.... and the wight isnt much better... the unit is so expensive it runs him in the 900 point range, so much so that even if i kill most of the entire rest of his army there is a good chance i wont win the game.
Any ways to kill it? ive tried cannons but generally he just raises back the few grave guard i do kill, and knights and characters tend to just bounce off and generally even if i get a flank charge or something, he can hold the unit together long enough till he can take out characters and then start butchering normal guys. SO what do i do about this uber unit?
With FIRE! remember, flaming attacks == no regen!
that is a rock hard unit, you are gonna need to get some good rolls and multiple units in it's face to do any significant damage.
I'm not really sure of empire specific tactics. as an orc player my solution would be to apply liberal ammounts of Grimgor, rinse, repeat, hope for the best.
The wight king is the linchpin. find a way to make him dissapear and things will become considerably easier, methinks.
Dwarfs: 3 - 3 - 0
Orcs 'n Goblins (mostly goblins) 0 - 3 - 1
Charge it with two stanks at once, hitting it with 6d3 str6 impact hits a piece. :p
might i propose making use of the lore of light? with its lowish casting values and excellent range of spells the lore of light can DECIMATE undead and deamonic armies like no tommorow ;Y
they beating you in melee? reduce their weapon skill to 1
regen getting you down? start throwing S6 magic missiles with flameing damage.
fear making your troops flee? make them immune to psyc ^_^
with all his eggs in that one basket putting a big dent in it will be tricky, but once you crack the outer shell i suspect his whole army will fall apart.
spambot kill tally: 79
[16:19] <@Alzer> Arky's right though
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> I know he is.
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> He usually is.
[16:20] <@Kaiser-> Sometimes it's intentional.
[00:01] <+zubus> i love you, ya skirt wearin nothern monkey! ^_^
Moob, I think he is talking about 2000 pionts, in which case he can only take one STank. Arklite's idea was a good one, a few lore of light wizards will destroy it quite easily. Or you could kill the wight king with those hochland rifle things you have, since the wight king can have a maximum of a 4+ (or less depending on the S of a rifle), followed by a regen save. Shoot him a few times and see him fall, then kill the unit with multiples cannons. Don't be afraid of spending so much on that unit, since once his general dies his army will follow (unless his whole army is made up of characters and rare vamps).
Does empire have any killing blow, if it does that will ignore armour and regen, so that's not a bad idea.
Hmm, pretty sure the stanks have no restriction on the number of them in the army beyond them being a rare choice.. but that was just a joke suggestion, though it would work!
Hochlands won't work against the wight king, though. Consider you need 5's to hit at long range, then 5's to wound, followed by (most likely) a 5+ save & 4+ regen... it's unlikely to cause multiple wounds in a single turn unless dice really hate the VC player or you have ~10. Then the wight king can just be healed by the vamp.
In all honesty, if you have enough magic to stuff the VHD, I'd try to kill everything else and leave that alone / stick bait units (detachments) in front of it so it can't hit anything important. Then work on the rest of the army.
And I don't know much about empire so don't blme me for not knowing 'bout the hochlands.(blame tzeentch)
Last edited by very_original; May 27th, 2008 at 20:22.
With 25 Structure points, i believe thats the old, unbelievable broken Stank. It got a redo for the new Empire book.
I actually do have a steam tank, and it does a pretty decent job of shredding large portions of his army, but so far ive been reluctant to get it into combat with the uber unit as the vam and wight can hurt it enough to make it useless though ill probably try throwing it in next time
as for lore of light.... the army i have been using has an arch lector, a warrior priest, a wizard and a BSB... but im still getting WAY out-magicked... generally i can stem the bleeding enough that his magic isnt uber horrible at least until he kills a few characters however with all his magic i have almost no chance of casting myself so that takes the lore of light off the table...
i guess ill just have to try to tough it out, steam tank, hellblaster and cannons. I was also thinking maybe a wizard with bears anger and van horstmans speculum could be a nasty surprise if i could get him to accept a challenge.
Thanks though! ill get that dastardly vamp sooner or later