Welcome to Librarium Online!
Right I am going to be playing my first major Warhammer battle withe new VC.
I am playing against an Orc and Goblin army. The guys doesn't generally go in for sneaky tricks but does like lots of orc boys.
I am expecting either a couple of Giants or lots of trolls
He also has a large unit of black Orc he pulls out on special occasions!.
He doesn't go in for magic too much but he does have that option (and I expect some kind of magic defense from him.
He also has the option of borrowing a load of my Orc and Goblin artillary if he wants.
I am planning on taking a very tough unit of Grave Guard and trying out the Varghulf at the very least. but any other particular advice, particularly in relation to core regiments?
Remember units of Dire Wolves are 40 pts for a Unit Str 10 group with an 18 inch flanking range. Also remember that if he uses uber killy heroes that you can use the armor that negates ASF
The Camden Brigade
Do good things, good things happen. Do bad things, and kharma hits you with a car.
20 Bucks. Eat it; Ride it; Hump it. I don't care. - Earl J. Hickey
Recently I have been experimenting with a unit of 20 zombies as a core choice. I know a lot of people will be snorting their derision right now but where else am I going to get 20 unbreakable fear causing models that can be raised beyond start size and get D6+4 per raise for 80 points which I have to spend on core anyway?
I personally find ghouls to be a tremendous pay off when fighting orcs and goblins, as they have T4 and poisen, they will be good for a go at the giant too!
Wraiths are pretty good versus O+G due to the low leadership of units, and the terror causing capacity to make large units run for the hills!
If you know you are in for a large infantry horde I would reccomend a corpse cart if you can squeeze one in, the ASF would have a large effect in any static combat.
The banner of double unit strenght is a must too - on either black knights for flanking or skeletons in order that you definately outnumber with a fear causing creature!
Arms are an instrument of evil, No measure for thoughtful men until there fail all other choice but sad acceptance of it.
Sun-Tse : The art of war
If you want a tough unit of GG Bang in a White king bsb on barded steed, lance and shield and give him the drakenhoff banner for a nice bit of regeneration on all in the unit. then put the royal banner on the unit Std for hatred to affect all in the unit once again. it may not be eternal hatred but saves you having to buy it on any vamps you put in the unit.
this gives you a unit in cc with a 3+ save, and 4+ regen, (the regen which can be used against crumble tests,) re-roll to hit in the first round of a combat for everyone, Standing combat res of 5 if you have 5 ranks and 6 with outnumber. on top of that a white king who is S6 on the charge with a 2+ save (then regen).
having the bsb in you army also mean you loose one less model than you would normaly from combat. so if you lost by 2, the bsb counters it so you only loose one model instead, and even then regen can stop that.
i find varghulfs often work best in 2's or supported by a vamp with avatar and talisman of lycni. they can even with hatred fluff thier attacks so only use them on small units alone.
i think a corpse cart is a must with load stone. knowing you always get a minimun of 2 and maximum of 7 (as a pose to 1 and 6) means you can be more confident in how you use your casting dice.
for your core, most people swear by ghouls due to thier T4 but i much preferre skeletons with a command and even warbanner. get a vampire with lord of dead and level 2 in the unit, maybe the tomb blade if your desperate and the nightmare shroud and see the unit fly up in numbers.
if you have them dire wolves are good for blocking line of site ( though i dont think you have to worry about it with orc artillary and your opponents lack of magic), but otherwise as flanking units or even just to capture table quarters are very much worth it. you could use them to great affect tieing up or leading away the giant and or trolls if you can use fast cavalry rite and have a 40 point unit lead a 205pts + around the field.
i dont like zombies. i only use them if i need to raise a unit either to block an enemy or for a table quarter. i would never put them into the army to begin with, only from rasing, it leaves you points to spend on more usefull units.
Also dont try to have lots of units. 2-3 blocks works fine for vamps. i personaly use a unit of 20 gg with a lord in (and equiped as above), and a unit of 14 skeletons (as above) which i raise to around 30 strong by around turn 3 (assuming im not fighting pesky high elves with drain magic).
for other units i have 2 units of 10 ghould on my flanks and 2 units of wolves in front, with that there is two carts (one load stone and one balefire), and a bland unit of unbarded black knights just because i had the points.
hope these reflections on my army type helps you in deciding how best to use yours,
Thanks for the advice everyone!
I think I probably will take a unit of Zombies. And a few Wraiths as well. I already know they are pretty good against non-magical monsters (such as Giants or Trolls)
well tickle me pink im embarrassed. I wonder where I got the 2d6 from. i'll certainly be a lot happier playing D6+4
Right playing over the weekend.
My rough army is
1 Vampire Lord tooled up for magic and Helm of Command
1 Necromancer + Corpse cart
20-30 Grave Gaurd double handed wepaons
6 Dire wolves
6 Dire wolves
x3 Cairn Wraiths (inc Banshee)
Working out exact equipment and magic items but I think this should do the trick. I will probably take Summon Ghouls to be able to raise d6+1 to bolster the smaller units.
Is that all of your 2000pts, you only have on dedicated combat unit!!!
I personally think that you've got too many grave guard! 15 to 20 should be enough, if you are worried about not outnumbering them, take the banner of the dead legion.
Just remember Orcs and Gobbos have LOTS of units, lots of fast units, lots of artillery, and most importantly LOTS OF DEDICATED COMBAT UNITS, (like 30 odd orc boyz)!
Your army has lots of units too, however you have one dedicated combat unit- the Grave Guard, as lets get real zombies are pathetic in combat, and 10 ghouls aren't much to fight a big unit of 30 or so Orcs with... Wights are a great choice however without the support of lots of combat units they can be overwhelmed by the numbers of the orc horde, instead of attacking those juicy unprotected monsters (which they will kick arse against..lol)
I say cut the Grave guard unit down, and take a unit of skellies instead (no spears, undead are meant to grind the enemy down, so a 4+ save is essential).
Take only 5 direwolves each, go with either the Varghulf OR the banshee. If he doesnt take much magic, go with the banshee and her entouage.. The vargulf can get overwhelmed by a giant or bashed by a unit of trolls. I have only had one battle with a varghulf, and he did NOTHING!!!
Basically, while it would be great to take all the nice and juicy powerful things in the VC army, it can get a bit too top heavy. and thus can give BIG CHUNKS of points away since there are only a few elite units. I like to have lots of the cheaper troops to support my powerful characters, and take special or rare units in moderation.. (I take 1/2 units of special in my 2000pt army).
THis gives me a base of numbers I can fall back on to if things get dire, plus enemy war machines have a harder time cutting down a unit of skellies than a unit of 5 blood knights. Also remember ANY UBER unit can be destroyed by skillful play. Flank and rear charges, traps and spells can whitle away any unit, or just plain bad dice rolls, just remember this saying, "with numbers you have options", thats number of units...lol..
Anyway I hope I have shed some helpful info for you Good Luck!!