Welcome to Librarium Online!
So, I was fighting an Empire army recently, and all of his infantry blocks had detachments. I think I got 90% of the charges, but he still killed me with his flanking. I was wondering how other Vampire Players dealt with Detachments. Also, I've run into problems with a Steam tank just charging into a unit with a Vampire, and killing everything. If anyone has any advice, it would be greatly appreciated, thank you in advanced.
One final question: This is kinda unrelated, but if a Unit of Cold Blooded Lizardmen Charged a Unit with the Screaming Banner, do the effects cancel, or do you roll 4 dice and take out the highest and lowest?
As per your screaming banner question I believe you would roll 4 dice and discard the highest and lowest as both say roll one extra die and discard. However if you want to simplify and your opponent agrees just roll 2 dice as normal. (I believe statistically they would create the same number sampling)
With the Steam Tank I would tarpit since it needs to be killed to get any VP's from it and to kill it will take a long time so it's not worth the hassle. Don't really have anything else to say as when ever I've played against one I have done enough damage to the rest of the empire army that I got away with ignoring it.
BEN DIESEL FTW!!!
This is reasonably simple as there isn't an actual rules contradiction. The Screaming banner makes you roll one more and discard the lowest, cold blooded makes you roll an extra and discard the highest. To this end you do just roll 4 dice.
In terms of statshammer - there is a BIG difference between rolling 4 and discarding high and low and rolling 2. You will find central numbers (6,7, coming up almost all of the time when you roll 4, as it has a much stronger averaging potential.
Current painting project: 2300 pts of Dwarfs in 5 weeks.
I wouldn't worry about detachment to much to be honest. There fighting blocks tend not to score many kills, so taking away ranks will win them combat, but it won't win them by much, so your units may slowly crumble it will, or at least should take some time before they completely fall apart.
Some pointer I could give are to use magic missiles to eat up a unit, detachments are small, around 9-10, some cases even smaller, so killing 5-6 should be more than enough to stop them from getting a flank and taking away your ranks. Another nice way is using a varghulf, sneak him up close, and say boo, empire leadership isn't the greatest, you'll have to hope he fails, and he should fail a few, and if they don't run away scare, well a he is more than capable of shredding them in combat. good practice is to have combat characters on the edge of units, so he can slice up detachments and get them to 4 or less asap so you regain your ranks. Also like was said earlier, use wolves to charge when your main blocks do, this may tie them up for a turn or two, so work quickly and kill the parent units before the dogs crumble, and if all else fails, hope they fail a leadership test for charging a fear causing unit.
Not all of these are sure fire ways of dealing with detachments, but they all help a little, and that is the best you can hope for, empire are know more for there guns, and they win combat the same as you do, mainly by static combat rez, the good thing is your troops won't run if you loose a combat by one or two points, so hold out till you can get some more support in there.
Sorry, double post
Last edited by BustaCaps; October 7th, 2009 at 16:09.
I've never had trouble with detachments... I wouldn't go for a suicide unit of wolves, because then they can just charge in next turn anyway so you need to make sure you break the original unit first. But the idea is right, go for maybe your own detachments of 10 ghouls (or skellies) making sure you have the summoning power so you can make it bigger if you need to.
Facing detachments is all about protecting your own flanks. If there is no space for them to charge, they cannot. If you are running a line with several infantry blocks next to each other there should be no space for the detachment to get in, even if you have to declare a charge with the outer units (even if they are probably a bit out and fail the charge) to get them into position on your flank to protect.
Shooting the detachment (magic) is also a viable option. Or send up some fell bats or wraiths with your troops to charge in and hack them up.
It is a little different with VC since you are never going to flee, but with most armies against detachments if you find yourself in a position where you cannot charge in without blocking the flank and stopping the detachment, simply don't charge. Spend your movement phase getting right in their face and consolidating your position so they either have to charge you (with no space on your flanks) or sit there and wait for you to charge them next turn (with plenty of support around to smash the detachment). Don't ever feel that you need to charge just because you are close enough to.
Another trick which will work well for VC since the units will probably survive for a turn is to go for the charge, let them flank you, then have a unit ready to flank or even rear charge the detachment. Then they find themselves severely beaten and outnumbered by fear.
I actually thought in regards to cold blooded etc. that the effects cancel. Not sure where I read that though, will have to check the LM FAQ again.
Ignoring the detachments will get you killed. Your regiments will crumble slowly, and Empire core troops are nothing to be scoffed at when they're striking first, hitting on 3's, and wounding on 4's.
You can use magic or faster-moving regiments to handle it. Personally, I summon a 'detachment' of my own. Zombies. This will negate all of the effects of any detachments. If the enemy charges you, they can't make a "supporting charge" without hitting the zombies. If you charge the enemy, remember to charge your zombies against their detachment BEFORE declaring against their parent regiment with your skeletons or what-have-yous. The detachment will have to elect to Hold, Flee, or S&S, then move the zombies in BEFORE moving your skeletons in. The detachment won't be able to counter-charge and flank you, or use an S&S.
If the empire player decides to try and BS his way through this, remind him to check his rulebook. Detachments are moved in AFTER the chargers hit the parent unit. If you charge the detachment first, there's nothing he can do about it.
For the STank: lore of metal, or a BUNCH of zombies right infront of it. Just be prepared to start boosting the vanHell out of that regiment, because they won't cause a single wound to that tank, and it's going to maul them in CC.
The banner: roll 4, discard highest and lowest.