Best Vampire Lord Build

[WraithGuardian]

Yes, the Night Shroud is considered "Magic Armor," but so are magic shields. It's a designation of what type of magic item it is (Talisman, Enchanted Item, etc.) On p. 502, armor/shields/helms are all considered to be "Magic Armor." This is because you can only have one piece of "Magic Armor." But just because you use the Enchanted Shield, doesn't mean that you can't wear heavy armor. Also, look at the items there on p. 502. If it is actually armor, or a shield (ie, it replaces the mundane version,) it says so directly under it's name and cost. For example- Armor of Fortune's description begins with "Heavy armor." Enchanted Shield's description starts with "Shield." Things like the Trickster's Helm, or in this case the Nightshroud, have no such designation, because they aren't actually armor or a shield.

You are reading in between the lines and missing the main point. Nigthshroud is considered "magic armor" (Under the name), and that is the ONLY thing that matters. The fact that it doesnt confer a basic save of any kind doesnt made a difference, by itself it gives a 6+ save, w/ shield a 5+, w/ helmet 4+. Magic armor => replaces normal armor and thats it. They can put in an item called baseball cap, but as long as its considered "magic armor" it will replace any armor the character may be wearing. It doesnt matter whether you put it on your head, arms, legs or whatever.

[TypeSet1]

Magic Armor under the name doesn't designate what type of item it is, it designates what category of magic item it is. The rule on p. 502 of the main rulebook is basically saying you can't wield two shields, or two suits of armor. You can, however, wear nonmagical heavy armor, and a shield, and still spend points to get the Dragonhelm. You can't, however, wear standard heavy armor and then buy the Armor of Destiny, because it says "Heavy armor" in it's description. You can't use a normal shield and also use the Charmed Shield. If you want to look in a newer release, look in the new OK book on p. 63, at the Gut Maw. It says "Magic Armour" under it's name, but goes on to clarify that it is heavy armor in the first line of the description, which means it not only takes up your one "Magic Armour" slot, but also counts as mundane heavy armor, meaning you can't take any other light armor/heavy armor/full plate/etc. See what I mean? Again, this is just my opinion, I can't find anything about this in any of the errata, but by the way you're saying it works, then if you took the Charmed Shield/Trickster's Helm/Helm of Discord/Spellshield/etc with a character, you couldn't take any mundane armor, because a Charmed Shield/Trickster's Helm/Helm of Discord/Spellshield/etc is considered "Magic Armor."

[WraithGuardian]

If you want to keep playing like that Im sure most of the newer players wont notice. But in a competitive setting they will never allow it, and most of the experienced players will call you out on it.

[Korpacz1]

Magic Armor under the name doesn't designate what type of item it is, it designates what category of magic item it is. The rule on p. 502 of the main rulebook is basically saying you can't wield two shields, or two suits of armor. You can, however, wear nonmagical heavy armor, and a shield, and still spend points to get the Dragonhelm. You can't, however, wear standard heavy armor and then buy the Armor of Destiny, because it says "Heavy armor" in it's description. You can't use a normal shield and also use the Charmed Shield. If you want to look in a newer release, look in the new OK book on p. 63, at the Gut Maw. It says "Magic Armour" under it's name, but goes on to clarify that it is heavy armor in the first line of the description, which means it not only takes up your one "Magic Armour" slot, but also counts as mundane heavy armor, meaning you can't take any other light armor/heavy armor/full plate/etc. See what I mean? Again, this is just my opinion, I can't find anything about this in any of the errata, but by the way you're saying it works, then if you took the Charmed Shield/Trickster's Helm/Helm of Discord/Spellshield/etc with a character, you couldn't take any mundane armor, because a Charmed Shield/Trickster's Helm/Helm of Discord/Spellshield/etc is considered "Magic Armor."

I see your point... why can I wear a dragon helm [magic armor] with mundane heavy armor and mundane shield, but I can't wear a nightshroud [magic armor] with mundane heavy armor and mundane shield?

For the same reason you can't wear armor of destiny with heavy armor, it's one or the other, and you can only ever take one magic armor item be it a shield, helm or body armor. Maybe you're of the opinion that the nightshroud is NOT body armor in fact, but similar to the dragon helm, a sort of accessory - "hey I'll just wrap this shroud over my armor" kinda deal. I think that's wishful thinking.

Unfortunately WraithGuardian has it right, you can try, but don't be surprised if people get mad about it once they find out

[camarodragon]

8th ed sure did a shoddy job at explaining the magic armour/ mundane armour. The problems seem to lie within the Helm variants of "Magical Armour + the Nightshroud" The other "Magic Armours" already have heavy or light armour listed in thier description with the exception of silvered steel.

Now Wraithguardian your saying If I take Helm of Discord, that I can not take Heavy Armour. You say this I believe because of the 1st Bullet point. ".Bla bla bla.............It replaces any mundane equivalent already worn by the model." Correct...??

But then following the logic if I took a Magic Sheild I would not be able to take magic armour because of the wording in the bullet point

However following TYPESET1's logic ,,, A helm is a helm, not armour and not a sheild. Just as Amour is Armour, not a helm and not a sheild. Just as a sheild is a Sheild, not a helm and not armour.

Ill probably catch hell for it, but 7th ed did a much better job of wording it...

If a model has a magic shield he is allowed to wear
a suit of normal armour. If a model is wearing a
magic helm he is allowed to wear a suit of normal
armour and carry a normal shield. If the model is
wearing a suit of magic armour he is allowed to
carry a normal shield.

Now yes, you may say its the wrong ed. but it sure is clearer to understand. but please check out pg 121, 7th ed book and you will see what I mean.

Also... So a Nightshroud is a Shroud, not Armour and not a helm and not a Sheild. So you can take Nightshroud + Normal Armour + Normal Sheild..

Discuss??

[Uhlan87]

I feel camarodragon is correct on this matter. If you couldn't wear the nightshroud along with light or heavy armor it would say it was light or heavy armor in its description like it does for the armor of destiny or the glittering scales. The nightshroud is more like the Trickster's helm.

[rothgar13]

It's definitely something you wear in conjunction with other pieces of armor. Its rules description is identical to the Dragonhelm. I'm frankly baffled that anyone would think otherwise.

[Korpacz1]

a shroud goes over the body like armor. one or the other. can't stack mundane armor and magical armor, thus can't stack shroud and mundane armor. Maybe if it was called a cape? Ya 8th ed. didn't make it clear. Just seems like people are making the argument that I can wrap my shroud around my armor which seems to be stretching the rules.

[WraithGuardian]

Regardless of what they meant, it all depends on the red shirts. If your local GW allows you to get away with heavy armor AND a shroud, then by all means feel free. My local store is strictly against it.

[theconman10]

In the 7^th Ed Vampire Counts book it says that the Night Shroud was light armour (p.85). Although, it does not state that it is in the current 8^th Ed book. However, the wording in the new book suggests it is a kind of wrapping (Shroud) and it is doubled in point costs. I would say it can be combined with mundane armour / helm / shield.