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  1. #1
    Senior Member Blackadder's Avatar
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    Are Vampires necessarily evil?

    Just wondering really, what do you think?

    Way I was thinking about it is because Vampires retain much of their personality, memory and so on, Vampires aren't necessarily evil. The majority I'd say are, either due to the fact that they're bad in the first place or used to be good but the curse of vampirism took it's toll.

    Anyway, what do you think?

    EDIT: Just to be clear I AM NOT BASING THIS OFF TWILIGHT - I haven't read the books, seen the films or anything...as I hate the whole teen romance bullshit story genre anyway, and when you throw fantasy stuff into the mix, I want to just gouge my eyes, ears, nose and tongue out so that I will not have the senses to be able to detect such an abomination...

    With that out of the way let me clarify - what I was actually thinking was because of the idea that vampires retain their personality, memory etc when they become a vampire, in the first few days/months/years, they may well retain some form of "Goodness" if that's how they were before-hand. Take for example, the Blood Knights, who before they were turned were in fact held in high regard (i.e. had a good reputation) - I can't imagine that the second they became vampires all of the nobility/honour about them was utterly exstinguished... look at Abhorash - he still held those kind of values after he was turned...

    Anyway, yeah, just to reiterate above - THIS IS NOT ABOUT TWILIGHT!

    Last edited by Blackadder; April 10th, 2012 at 12:23.

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  3. #2
    Member camarodragon's Avatar
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    I would have to agree with you. Just look at the realistic Twilight series. Most of those vampires are good and just want to go to High School, play baseball, get married and have babies.
    <sacasim>

    Ughh.. no. that movie has set vampirism back 1000 years. Kids nowadays think vampirism is all about being friends, hangin out and glittering in the sunlight like sparkling angels.. Vampires are EVIL.. they kill things, good things, bad things, it doesn't matter to a vampire as long as you have blood.

    Just my opinion....
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    EWOP adamwelton's Avatar
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    EWOP adamwelton's Avatar
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    Sorry, just my bit of fun there.

    Nope, you're quite right. I believe that the idea is for the Thirst to turn victims into meta-humans. The ones who volunteer for it tend to be megalomaniac sociopaths in the first place, and the ones who don't tend to be somewhat peeved with the world afterwards, unsurprisingly. Although they retain their memories, their overwhelming desire to feed will subsume any emotions they may have had. They are no longer human. Their metabolic rate increases and they effectively become a lesser version of those affected by the Rage virus in the 28 Days/28 Weeks storyline. It's only their ingrained personality traits that prevent them from going completely mental much as we humans vary in our emotional states. Only Vampires have it a LOT worse, possibly like a permanent hangover for a terminal alcoholic. It's no surprise to me that traditionally they're very angry indeed.

    For me the Blade films had everything organised. There are so many theories about Vampirism that we know of as pure fiction, but what we understand about human/Vampire interaction is based on scientific fact. Abraham Stoker used the historic link with Vlad Tepes to convince many people in the 19th century that they existed. The rest as they say is history.
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  6. #5
    Sir Proofreader Deadstar_MRC's Avatar
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    I think this is one of those highly general statements that can't actually be defined one way or the other.

    Vampires are many and varied after all, and some (perhaps I should say most) are portrayed as evil, but of course there are others in many forms of fiction that aren't outright evil and some that may even be considered helpful.

    I guess it may depend on the nature of the person before they were turned. In the Warhammer Fantasy setting it seems a lot of Vampires arise from mortals delving in to Necromancy, being corrupted my Dark Magic and power, and then eventually being turned, in which case they're either at the edge of their sanity or certainly a fair way down the 'evil' path.

    But, as you mentioned with Abhorash - he was essentially a loyal, honourable knight, even after he was turned. Yes, maybe slaughtering an army that opposes your existence is an evil act, but his motivation would likely have been a sense of duty, a duty to protect the queen. I don't know if that's necessarily evil or simply a little misguided.

    On a personal note, when I wrote up the backstory for my Vampire, I attempted to portray her as a scholar of sorts. She mainly seeks knowledge about Vampirism and Necromancy, keeping to herself for the most part. Occasionally she might draw up an army and go 'researching' (i.e. acquiring new forbidden tomes off people that don't want to hand them over or something like that) but she's open to negotiation and quite happy to avoid fighting if she can get what she wants via peaceful means.

    So I suppose if a 'good' person was turned, they could be a not so bad Vampire. I'm not sure if it would last forever, though - You'd have to deal with a lot of hostility from those around you, you'd see mortal friends pass on while you continued living, and its likely that some memories would fade over the years. Would they eventually be corrupted by their curse, or could they maintain a certain standard of morality that defined them as good?

    Or would they eventually just go crazy and/or end up with Vampire Alzheimers, yelling at the zombies to get off their lawn?

    Most likely scenario is, unless they're good at hiding their nature, they'd be hunted down and killed. Wouldn't do wonders for your faith in humanity, seeing all your friends turn on you, so maybe its also a question of whether their friends and family are also good people, and capable of believing old Joe down the road whom we've know for years is still just good old Joe, not some bloodsucking monster likely to treat us like a blood smoothy at the first available opportunity.
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    They're undead. All undead is evil in my book. Now night goblins, they're the ones who are misunderstood as evil. Lol

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    Drill Sergeant Lord Borak's Avatar
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    Read the Genevieve (Drachenfels) Series. That should give you a bit of a different perspective than the usual CONQUER EVERYTHING that the Von Carstiens seem to have going for them. Also, the Gotrek and Felix novels, and eventually Ulrika (Bloodborn) driven spinoff are a good read too. A lot, or most, of the Vampires are interested in keeping the 'stats quo' and that generally means keeping the Empire alive. How they do it really depends on the individual Vampire.

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    EWOP adamwelton's Avatar
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    sparklefag
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    Born from Tears of Angels WraithGuardian's Avatar
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    People are too blunt with their generalization. Just because you are no longer human, doesnt necesserely mean you are evil. Some retain their honor and discipline after turning, they mayu chose to live their life according to a code. Others think they are better than everything living and start killing left and right. Others are so obsessed with feeding that they descend into beasthood, literally turning into a monster.

    It is what it is, you cant blame a vampire for being a victim of his own nature. Dont forget, after you are no longer human you are automatically a kill on sight by everyone living around you. Even if you would want to live your life in peace after the turning, you wont have that chance because neither imperials not Bretonians will ever tolerate a vampire living next door and will burn him on a cross the second the see him. So in the end, you are forced to live your life out in seclusion, constatly having bounty hunters and adventurers knocking on your door trying to kill you for money or gain a name for themselves. You are forced to defend yourself, and take lives in the process, and that right there grants you the title "evil" whether you want to or not.
    So in the end, a vampire can be whatever heor she wants himself to be but in the eyes of the living he will always be considered the enemy.

  11. #10
    Member whatfruit's Avatar
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    I have always seen vampires in the warhammer fanstasy settings as driven by their own obsessions in their mortal life. I believe that blood dragons found a cure for their vampirism if they fed on a dragon and that their constant seeking of worthy opponents was them honing their skills for the inevitable confrontation. I remember in the 6th ed book there was a story about a brettonian knight who fought a blood dragon and because he fought so well the Vampire let him live.


    The Nerchra are usually wizards obsessed with their own mortality who end up becoming vampires so they will never die and can continue their scholarly pursuits forever hoping to become the most powerful wizard.
    The van Carstiens are obsessed with domination and power over others sort of like nobles and aristocrats who see everything beneath them and that they should rule through fear they don’t want to just kill the empire but want to enslave it.
    The Lahamians are vain only wanting to keep their beauty and are political movers and shakers, they want influence over others but unlike the van carstiens they do not want to rule directly.


    The warhammer fanatasy vampires clans though are heavily ripped off from White Wolf RPG.
    Blood Dragons – Brujah
    Lahmians- Venture
    Strigoi- Gangrel/Nosferatu
    Nechra – Tremere
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