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Very nice and succinct tactica. Very informative, strewart, any player that's interested in vampire counts syvania will find this useful, especially a newbie. I liked that fact that you covered absolutely everything, (well nearly) and you used a different colour :p .
Well it certainly helped me. I 've been thinking of starting a syvania army for quite a while now, a pure vampire army has always caught my eye. I probably will now. (pity you can't get a pure blood dragon list which is official).
PS: a mod should sticky this.
Hear, hear. Sticky, sticky!
Thou shalt demandeth nothing of the Gods.. sorry Mods. But.. I shalt stickyeth for thine seeth merit ineth it.
Instrested Read, Sorry I am responding to a two month old thread, but I wish to deleveop this more with you.
I am also a Slyvania Player, and have only played Two Thousands Points
Played against 2000 point Demon Nurgel Army today, and did just about as well as I expected, and ended up with a draw, in his favour.
This is what I am currently Running, and not that far from you above:
GS, LVL 3
Crowned of the Damn
book of arkhan
GS, heavy armour sheidl
GS, heavy armour sheidl
20 levy, Spear Shield (Acts as line of skrimhers
14 levy with Spear & shield with Standart (Thrall)
14 levy with Spear & shield with Standart (Thrall)
19 militia with Spears & Shield with standart (Lord Goes here)
3 fell bats
15 drakenhof guard (Plate, GS) including Standartand & Champoin drakenhof banner , keep switing back and forth between banner of burrows)
2 Black Coaches
I really believe Vampire Counts two weekest match ups wiill be Nurgle demons & Slayers. The only advantage we have over nurgle is more units, we are horde or beatdown. Slayers just not winnable, only way to hurt them is inflict wounds and zombies and skele just do not do it, and our shooting is not enouhgt. I was extremely happy with my Draw.
Demon Priince, Demon Flies Insane hammer, flying i forget the rest
Two block of three plague riders
Two Block of three nurgel swarms
Two Block of Plague Bearer, 4 ranks with ward save, 3 ranks normal
1 nurgle chariot
The Battle was very lenghty 6 turns taking us about 2 and half hours. The first conern was his flying demon price, with sawrm, 5 wounds, and no amour save weapon, whatever it is called. My obvious conerns where it going for my general in my block of skeletons. I deployed my skeleton in the center, and with a black coach angled for when he would changelle my general. (Impact hits still go through challeges!!) Then it occured to me, that my Chariots are even meater target for him. So i also deployed my other chariot next to it brother, so thier line of sight was like an X crisscrossing at where he choosed to charge eiither Everything was spead out on the sides,
Grave markers were placed almost all three in the center, becuase i for me to win I need to control the center, and need to present a strong board position with my reinforcements.
Again very lenghty game, went on with his price knocking my into one my Zombies with a Thrall in it. He changelled his crushed me with me doing two wounds to the beast. I summoned from two grave markers a slew of Crossbow skele. (He has only two dispel dice). Three wounds, One no save Woot! With the grave markers producing free maverablity for me, I also just marched foward keeping his guys pointed at me, while i was able to dig in the oflanks. My coached both ended up taking on plaguebears units initally crushing them, after he went through several speed bumps. His price circled around and and took one charoit from the back. and negating my zombie ranks, as he was able to base them on both units. From there we both just traded blows back and forth. I was able to march blcok his plague riders turn one fell bats, and summon wolfes from side table edge, and they just swept throught whatever was in thier path, 20 attacks from them do hurt, a lot. His prince eventally comming at my general, and i healing my Lord, really really made him frown. We ended the game with our generals locked into combat with a greatly weakend unit of plague bears into my flank with my coach into his flank.
The sruviving Chariot was the mvp of the game. He basically destoryed half a pllague bearer unit himself, Supported a charge into a Swarm, and Blasted another Plague bearer flank on my general, Free reform, with movenet and using the Book for charge is dirty. Two chariot supporting each other leaves not much standing.
You pointed out that you only tired one chariot. They play the same role as Black knights., on the charge they hit harder, They basically regenerate and can get syched. Movement Reform, magic them into something. They are less bulky to move around, they can get LOS becuase Large target anything in front of them. The Biggest thing is this, people really really frown and shake thier heads when they see you field two. Way too many people over commit to taking them both out, becuase the Terror (litterally) mentally and the power they have. Plus how many people do you know expect it? I have had Experienced GW staff put everything they got in two rounds to take them out, and it just allowed me to run them while i flanked his bertonias.
One Thing I want to bring up is Why are you so keen on Halberts? Light Amount shield and hand weapon Save +4 / +5 is much greater, since zombies are unlikely to kill anything, and with no always striking last, it just seems a waste.
anyways I would love to discuess this more with you.
Last edited by Shen; September 11th, 2005 at 08:15.
Yep, thats why. I dont know why, a single strength 7 hit and your 175 points are down the drain, but my gaming group say two is cheesy and since I seem to go well enough with only one I'll just stick to that.You pointed out that you only tired one chariot. They play the same role as Black knights., on the charge they hit harder, They basically regenerate and can get syched. Movement Reform, magic them into something. They are less bulky to move around, they can get LOS becuase Large target anything in front of them. The Biggest thing is this, people really really frown and shake thier heads when they see you field twoIMO, that unit is too small. Its ok with militia and levy, because you can just raise more during the game, but Drakenhof really need to start with large numbers (20) and be kept out of line of fire. They often don't kill that much more than core troops, so they need to rely on numbers to win combat too.15 drakenhof guard (Plate, GS) including Standartand & Champoin drakenhof banner , keep switing back and forth between banner of burrows)
Another difference in your list, you haven't included the fast thrall that I always take. He has proven invaluable countless times now, his kill count is probably up there with my general though he has been more useful for shutting down opponents magic early on and destroying pesky chariots, while my lord has just carved. Consider the thrall, 1+ armour save, s7 and 18" charge is just plain nasty.Yep, they are a waste. I just put that because it came up as default when I was writing my list from AB, and you get them or spears for free. I always just revert to hand weapon and shield.One Thing I want to bring up is Why are you so keen on Halberts? Light Amount shield and hand weapon Save +4 / +5 is much greater, since zombies are unlikely to kill anything, and with no always striking last, it just seems a waste
Thanks for the feedback, good luck in your games.
Hi, great tactica strewert, I'm in the process of converting my VC to sylvanin, since I play Von Carsteins anyways, and I've always loved their fluff (I mean, come on, we get Drakenhof Templars! sounds too cool to pass on).
Only thing I wanted to bring up was the Drakenhof Guard. Why fish out for the upgrade, to lower their save to 4+
As has been stated, they rarely kill much anyway, so I'd rather get a better save, to keep them from getting killed, hence wining by combat resolution instead. What do you think?
With the banner of the barrows, they sure as heck do benefit from getting great weapons.
I would say it may be worth it if they have that banner, it makes them killing machines, but otherwise hand weapon and shield probably is more effective. Of course, the whole 'Drakenhof Guard' name sounds a lot better than Grave Guard, so if I have the points I often upgrade them just for the cool name. :cool:
One Chariot or Two, it is still a beast. Even from very experienced players i always seem them overeact to two chariots. I guess I make my oppents roll thier fear for themselves. heh.Originally Posted by strewart
Another way I look at it, is this, My Grave markers will create all the board position i need becuase my oppent will have to move around it, to act on them. The best way to take advantage of these oppunirties is bring in unts that cause pain. This allows me to take more consolidated heavy hitters instead of a normal list. I am going to goto the extreme of the heavy hitters, and then roll back it some to find the good balance. I Think i am at the balance now, with adding my black knights below.
Grave guard too small? with 5 extra men all you really are doing is wasting a lot extra attacks that you cannot have and not being effiecent with those points.. Sometimes I even make my guard into a line of seven to maxuim attacks, sort of taking MSU into here. I just have a different role for my men, I tend to lean to kill blows against > against more elites unit and espically cavarly, Ranks > when same general stats or weaker stats, (this is also where I Use shields instead of hands weapons.)
About Halberts, when you take Halberts you no longer can take Shields. That leaves you only with Hand weapon. That is why there is an "OR" instead of comma. Please check the rules and if you do not believe me ask GW as they will confirm this also.
While I am picking at you, your oringal post about Musicans is wrong. If combat is tied and niether side has a musians then it is a draw, but if one does have it, it is treated as Won by combat by one, this is stated almost like this in the core rulebook. Musicans greatest advantage is rallying. We do not have this problem that is the primary reason why i do not take them, and that combat is rarely tied, i always look into my chances before moving. Chance favours the Prepared mind.
I like your fast thrall, I think i will try him next couple of weeks and see how he works out. The problem is I am playing 2,000 where I really need his support more, than a specalist hunter. You have one more character slot, and I had to pick what was more imporant. I almost compensate I fill my fell bats in same role, and I know it not effiective.
I dropped my line of Zombies. It was cool but also found just uses more free space. Taken 5 Black knights with Banner of Burrows, and keeping grave guard with Drankelof.
I have Dark Elfes and Brentonia Matches on Saturday, and Beastmen on Sunday. I will post you a summary of my list and show the results.
Last edited by Shen; September 23rd, 2005 at 06:13.