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  1. #1
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    Lizard problems?

    Hello fellow Zomboys and Girls,
    I thought I would welcome myself back to LO from quite an absence with a quick question, I was wondering if there is a particular army(ies) that you find it hard to encounter with our lovely pale friends, the VC. (In particular - those scaly fiends from Lustria.)

    You see, I have a match (2150 pts.) scheduled against some Lizardmen, and well.. I'm not too confident about the game's outcome. Does anyone have any helpful information or tips concerning actually doing well against the Lizards?

    While reading the Lizardmen armybook, I started to wonder about how much their Leadership rule would affect the various Psych. Tests while playing against my Blood dragons.

    (Is this even in the right section? It's so hard to tell.. ;P)

    I am planning on using Blood dragons, with several units of well (For a skelly) armored skeletons, and most likely a large unit of Zombies to throw around, as core. Then a unit of Black knights (To acompany my Lord..) and good old Grave guard. (Any ideas as to where to go from here, units-wise?)

    My friend usually uses (For higher point games.) a stupidly-powerful Slann with several skink priests, a large unit of temple guard, a Saurus unit and too many skinks. (A very Magic Heavy army.)

    Excuse the post if it's illegible, I'm very tired, And thank you in advance for any help.
    - Katfizh

    Last edited by Zombiekatfizh; April 30th, 2006 at 04:59.

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    Senior Member Big_Canadian's Avatar
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    getmagic D and just try to win combats man... I would not trust your fear to win you this one. You will have to have BK and wolves and out manouvre them. The army I hate playign againdt with my VC is either VC or TK!!! I hate not being able to use my rules almost at all!!
    What you are we once were. What we are you will become!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big_Canadian
    getmagic D and just try to win combats man... I would not trust your fear to win you this one. You will have to have BK and wolves and out manouvre them. The army I hate playign againdt with my VC is either VC or TK!!! I hate not being able to use my rules almost at all!!
    Yeah, I'm sure beating two skelly's heads together would be mighty boring, thanks for the advice though man.

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    Senior Member The vampire Lestat's Avatar
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    I hate tzeentch daemon armies, immune to psyk and they out magic me. As for lizards lock their infantry and target their mages, if you can manage to out magic them, necromancy can win, how-ever with blood dragons this isnt as much of an option, but you'll still need to bring down those mages soonest.

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    Senior Member Big_Canadian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zombiekatfizh
    Yeah, I'm sure beating two skelly's heads together would be mighty boring, thanks for the advice though man.
    no problamo. just make sure to keep your general alive lol... or else your pretty much screwed, but I guess that was kind of a given.
    What you are we once were. What we are you will become!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by The vampire Lestat
    I hate tzeentch daemon armies, immune to psyk and they out magic me. As for lizards lock their infantry and target their mages, if you can manage to out magic them, necromancy can win, how-ever with blood dragons this isnt as much of an option, but you'll still need to bring down those mages soonest.
    I don't think this is necessarily the case, everytime someone slaughters my lizards the slann/wizards tend to survive the battle unscathed. Just be sure you have a solid magic defence. Also watch out for those skinks, remember the undead are no longer safe from poison

    If he's running temple guard and a slann then he has to put them together, on which case you've got a 800 point unit running around that has movement only 4". This is one reason why i never take temple guard, they seem like a point sponge.

    If you can cause this unit to flee and chase it down then you are laughing, because he will lose his general's ld and all his skinks have ld 5, which even with cold blood ain't a sure fire bet.

    Good luck man, although secretly i hope the forces of lustria prevail

    Ciao

    Stonehambey

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    Lizardmen aren't too hard to beat. Your opponents overconfidence should be his main weakness.

    For example he probably thinks his Temple guard and Slann are the dogs bo***cks however a large unit of grave guard with a wight Lord tooled up (war banner plus banner of the barrows) will beat them through CR and unless he has appropriate magic items yo can make them run if you outnumber him (I have used this tactic twice and it has worked a treat both times).

    Fear can still do alot of damage against Lizard men so don't underestimate it. Cold Blooded is basically the same as adding about +1 to the units Ld in my experience (that might not be completly mathamatically accurate anyone care to shed some light on th exact maths of it?)

    Magic is harder I would suggest two or three Necromancers tooled up with dispel magic scrolls and close down the magic phase completly in the first two turns allowing you to get into position so that any magic he brings out later will be to little to late.

    I would counter his skinks with a lot of Dire Wolves, their 18 inch charge range should be enough to close in real fast and they can generally beat skinks in a one on one fight.

    Summery

    make the Temple Guard and Slann flee sounds hard but isn't impossible given the right unit (GG etc) you Black Knights should be taking out his sarus regiment. I would also have a unit of Fell bats around to pick off any units that flee because the main problem with Lizard men isn't making them run but stopping them rallying.
    Last edited by Visitor Q; April 30th, 2006 at 13:24.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berny Mac
    Lizardmen aren't too hard to beat.
    This is a very sweeping generalisation, surely it depends on the person you are playing against?

    But you're right about the slann and temple guard, as i said before, i think they are huge points sink.

    I'm doing a degree in mathematics and working out the two differences between the probabilities of normal ld and cold blood would be a pretty lengthy process, i will e-mail my statistics lecturer and ask him how to go about it. Keep your eyes peeled in the lizardman forum for the result!

    Ciao

    Stonehambey

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    The only problem beating the Temple Guard unit is that he may have given the unit that banner that makes it cause fear (meaning no auto-flee). Then they will be stubborn on Ld9, cold-blooded and can re-roll break tests (assuming Slaan is BS AND they would cause fear....Might be hard to bring down....If they don't have that banner, just try to win combat and auto-break them if you can. Otherwise just try to pummel them until they eventually fail their leadership test....but that would take a while. You could cast magic at the Slaan or the unit it is in to try to weaken them before combat, or you could simply leave that unit until last and concentrate on the rest of the army. Once the slaan unit is the only unit left you can't go far wrong!

    As for that maths....I won't do it but I am pretty sure cold-blooded makes their leadership roughly 2 higher. I'm pretty sure that's the case for Skink leadership. Average roll on 2 dice is 7, skinks are Ld5, and I think rolling 3 dice and removing the highest would give you an average of 5....I think that makes sense. That is 2 higher (equivalent of Ld not cold blooded) for skinks anyway, so I would assume roughly 2 higher for the others. That isn't accurate though, so don't take my word for it (like anybody would anyway :shifty: ).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stonehambey
    This is a very sweeping generalisation, surely it depends on the person you are playing against?
    Point taken. I was more reffering to the fact that Zombiekatfish thought Lizard men were particularly hard to beat.

    As for the Temple Guard the other thing to do is charge them with a zombie regiment and then keep raising zombies your opponent will have just wasted 800+pts while you destroy the rest of his army.
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