How in the hell do you win with Vampire Counts? - Warhammer 40K Fantasy
 

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  1. #1
    LO Zealot MobiusPrime's Avatar
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    How in the hell do you win with Vampire Counts?

    Alright, I've got a problem. We have a Vampire Count player in our gaming group that, to my recollection, has never won a game...ever.

    I'm not aware of specifics, but currently, his army consists of a Vampire and two or three Necromancers, two blocks of skeletons, a block of Grave Guard, two Banshees, and the rest of his points are put into blocks of zombies of varying size.

    Each game that he plays is a total defeat, and he will rarely if ever score a single victory point through the destruction of enemy forces, whereas the majority of his army is picked to pieces as he is innevitably outmaneuvered and his mages get killed.

    I've tried to offer advice on what to do to improve his game (most notably, I think he should add the knight guys you have, the mounted Grave Guard guys and some mage hunting elements like felbats), but mostly all I hear in return is how useless they are and how my Casket of Souls shouldn't affect immune to psychology troops because his Banshees can't and they are the same thing (which they aren't! Why can't he see that!?)

    My gaming group is extremely small, so I want each opponent to be a good challenge. What are somethings that you as VC have used to great success in winning? What I'm planning to do is take your responses and proxy it as an army using my TK to forcibly show our VC player that you need more than shambling zombies and skeletons to win battles (which, btw, is a concept I've never been able to wrap my head around, but I'm a TK player, and we have great 'punch' units like Ushabti and Chariots)

    Any help would be great. Thanks.


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  3. #2
    Senior Member Orkbert's Avatar
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    Basically, he'd need something mobile. I know, outside of general's range nothing can march anyways, unless with another character in the unit if I'm not mistaken (might be, I don't play VC myself), but 12" radius 'round the general is still quite large.
    So from experience with our VC player, I'd say take Ghouls (even if they flee, the rest of your is immune to panic anyways :rolleyes: they cause fear and have poisoned attacks), Dire Wolves (fast cav. to move into threatening the enemy's flank, assault enemy war machines early in the game and so on), Black Knights (Toughness 4 heavy cavalry, able to take magic banner <_< ) and/or spirit hosts (pitched against the right foe they will block them for quite a while if not even destroying them)

    So my strongest recommendations would be Wolves and Black Knights (i.e. get some cavalry, be it light or heavy):excl:

  4. #3
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    You are kidding me, right? I am shelving my VC because they are too easy to win with.

    I agree that he needs some speed. Not knights though. They are a pointsink and die to easily against rank and file.

    What he needs is some hunters. The hunters need to take out the warmachines and mages so you can march across the field without problems and you can dominate the magic phase.

    Tell him to get 2 units of 3 fell bats and 3 or 4 units of 5 wolves. That will cover your hunting needs and the wolves are great for taking over the movement phase and preventing getting outmanouvered.

    I don't know what vampires he uses but a change in blood line might be a good idea. I would suggest Strigio.

  5. #4
    Junior Member sergeantmkoll's Avatar
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    take dire wolves and maybe a wraith to take out lone wizards and hit the side of other combats. maybe even take some black knights cos killing blow lances are really nasty

    also less necromancers cos those guys are just askin to be picked off.
    Sergeant Mkoll

  6. #5
    Member skilett's Avatar
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    I toyally agree with the cavalry advice, knights and wolves. I usually have a group of 5-6 knights and at least 3 groups of wolves at 5-7. I currently own 20 wolves, and rarely, if ever, use less than 15, as they just help your movement immensely, for flanking and hunting.
    Personally I've only tried Grave Guard a few times, and I actually like skeletons better, as every time a wight die I know he won't be coming back. The knights pack a good punch, and have mobility going for them, but the Grave Guard I just don't like.
    So yeah, with VC you need to get outnumbering and flanks, then you will autobreak most opponents, and that's how you win.

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    my friend always field a squad of 9 knights + Thrall and it always kill alot of my Saurus so it probably should work with your friend too.

  8. #7
    Senior Member BustaCaps's Avatar
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    I'm suprised no one has mentioned spirit host yet, these guys are incredible, they can hold up large units of troops for a few turns so you can get a flank, they are great flankers themselves, and can only be hit my magical means.

    I use them mainly as flankers, and pretty much always use a unit of atleast 3 in 1000 points or more. Combine this with the book of arkan, and any dance spells you can roll and this unit can get in the right spots fast.

    Your friend seems to be a young guy who isn't willing to take any advice and wants to do his own thing, and thinks big blocks is the only way to go, if he is so ignorant not to take any advice the only thing I can advice is when you play him to totally annihalate him, this will make him think more about his army. Although he may justr get fed up and leave the hobby, but it will probably be for his own good then, since if he can't manage to win or have fun playing the game he isn't worth playing against.

    This may seem harsh, but as a veteran I have played a lot of people who are new to the game, a lot of them can take advice, and some of them can't. The ones who can't are the ones who always lose, and I care little about those people who are so stubbern that they can't take any advice, and can't improve there game.

  9. #8
    Member skilett's Avatar
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    Well, to be fair, Orkbert mentioned Spirit Host. And they are good, I also have 3 in almost every army I play, I mostly play 2000+ though. I would still get wolves first for the versatility.

  10. #9
    Nightlord frozencore's Avatar
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    What can I say that hasn't already been said. Wolves are key they flank and everyone knows flanking wins you combat, and if you win combat you make them run away with fear. Have some bats to take out war machines. In VC hero building and placement is really key but once you get a good list down they are prety hard to stop. I can recall certain games when I got first turn on my enemies and won in the second round before he even got his next turn. Its mainly the reason I don't play them anymore, people just don't want to play me if I use my Vampires.

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    Actually I disagree on the wolves. I agree on taking them but not for flanking. Very rarely I use them for that. I take 4 units of 5. They start the game as being hunters together with 2 units of fell bats. Then when there is nothing to hunt anymore they move into a redirection role. I hate using wolves to flank with as they are too easy to kill. I mean yes you get to remove ranks but most likely your opponent gets that combat res back from killing wolves. it is better to disturb the opponents battle line with them and make units expose their flanks to your combat units.

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