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Warriors of Chaos
Orcs and Goblins
Okay, so I'm returning to warhammer fantasy after taking a 7th edition out and I'n planning on hitting home with an all cavalry army.
My choice, Empire. With core knight, special inner circle knights, fast pistoleers, ranged outrider, I reckon it's the most varied and effective army to build an ALL cavalry force with.
Quite simply, you thoughts here.......
Are you kidding me!! This is a no brainer. Lance formations make bretonnian cavalry so cost effective that none of the 'full cavalry' armies even comes close to being second.
Ok so we have no mounted archers. But we have the lance.
Pegasi knights as flying cavalry can charge enemy warmachines over other units, lanceformations have good attacks, and a good armoursave to wait out the enemy hordes. Grail knights are still insanely brutal, and less expensive than their chaos rivals( and free champions for all units). And we have mounted damsels to give magic resistance to our units and the lores of beasts and life (the 2 we will be bringing) are perfect allies to a cavalry force.
Provided war hounds are allowed, the chaos knights can be devastating, especially with the right Marks, but as you said, empire has plenty of choices that are nice. I do think that chaos knight lists will be more common than empire cavalry lists.
my top 5:
4. high elves
- edit - changed nr 4 from empire to elves >.<
Last edited by Digger; July 19th, 2010 at 10:54.
Warchief Diggah o da Bloodmoon Squiggahs
Correction, Mounted Yeomen do have bows...
Still id prefer some flying cavalry
about the other choices:
- Wood Elves: No options. Their cavalry consists out of light cavalry. From what i read in wood elf forum, those are not very popular either
- Dark Elves: Cold ones, some chariots and dark riders. Not bad.
Possibly some big badass dragonrider Still nothing special
- High Elves: highly effective on all sides. Ellyrian reavers are superb light cavalry, and the mighty Initiative AND Allways Strike First, make silver helms and dragon princes a force to be reckoned.Their pain comes from Star Dragons, even in 8th they are fearsome and get thunderstomp and they beat almost any other big Monsterrider in a heartbeat
And they have Lion chariots. Ouch!
Might even rank these better than empire on second thought
- Orcs&Goblins: Meh... speedy gits, very cheap. Savage Boars suffer when it comes to the being frenzy+light armour. Normal boars are too expensive for bringing extra ranks. Chariots are cheap. So cheap that you can easily bring 3 boar chariots, 3 wolf chariots, and a Whole bucketload of characters riding chariots, and a few pump wagons aswell...Still meh...
- Tomb Kings: These are NOT in the LIST! xD
Granted theres not a whole lot of choice there. But they do come with fast cavalry chariots as core choice that are without rivalry the cheapest chariots in game.. What more do you want? Better than wood elf cavalry no doubt!
- Empire:Lots of choices. All very mediocre, but they have very nifty gunner cavalry. With the Steamtank and possibilities to bring quite cheap cavalry these guys have alot of medium options. But lets face it. these guys are and allways will be: medium. In 8th their main strengths lie in cheap infantry supported by tons of artillery choices and some cavalry backup. Going all cavalry here is a waste of half your armybook...
Last edited by Digger; July 19th, 2010 at 10:52.
Warchief Diggah o da Bloodmoon Squiggahs
High Elves don't have a core cavalry choice... My friend was very unamused by the fact
An ex of mine had a chaos all mounted army. Was a brutal force. With some skill it would have been amazing!
Tomb King cavalry army is possibly the most masochistic thing I've heard in a long time...
Brettonians and Empire are perhaps the simplest forces to devise as all cavalry, that is a good strength for them as well, uncomplicated, effective and inexpensive.
Greeskins could amount to some amusement as a cavalry force, not seen one in force though.
Dark Elves, all cavalry, would be interesting... very expensive... but interesting... would perhaps need some infantry with more flavour though to add towards it.
Wood Elves... possible. Glade Riders, Warhawk Riders and Wild Riders are all there... not sure it would be enough to make an effective force though. Could be interesting. Would cost a fortune.
Another one where all mounted is possible is Beastmen. Centigor can be made a Core choice, there are also core and special chariots available to characters as well.
Fantasy: Wood Elves, Dark Elves, Beastmen and Tomb Kings.
LotR: Misty Mountains and Rohan
All cav goes to Warriors. Specially now that Initiative reigns supreme in combat. Our characters are more deadly, our magic is more deadly, model for model our knights are more deadly. All Brets get is the lance formation.
Warriors really shine when you add monsters to their cav though. Throw some ogres/trolls/drogres in, or a hellcannon.
An all cav DElf list for me would include a ton of dark riders and sorcerers. Screw stupidity.
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I would say Warriors are the best, as the light cav core can have throwing axes and are still decent fighters. While the normal knights are still very effective at killing stuff.
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Although Chaos cavalry is good, it doesn't stack up in an all cavalry list. Initiative reigns supreme when you do not have numbers. If you do, it doesn't remotely matter.
A bretonian lance hits just as hard as Chaos knights at even cost. Except then get a ward and almost triple the wounds.
I would say that the Brets edge out Chaos by a good deal, and then that Chaos has a hefty lead over the next most valid All-Cav army: Empire.
Bretonians don't win because they have initiative. Nor do they win just because they're an inch faster. They certainly don't win because they are armed with a lance. No- Brets win because they can actually have RANKS, and they can actually ATTACK with those ranks. The outside edges of the formations will hit with everything, and then the front and following rank attack as well. 9 Bretonian knights is big enough to negate a rank bonus with ease, and crank out a solid 8 attacks. 8 knights of any other race can't do that, and they cost as much or more than a core breton. Their wardsave is awesome, which makes up for their lack of armor compared to the #2 and #3 choices.
Why doesn't the lance factor as a weapon? Because you have to charge to get it. This is what puts Chaos in second place. They have S3, +2S guys who can grab that bonus regardless of who charges: marauders with flails. Flails are just broken on cavalry now, and every Chaos cavalry option can get them (with the exception of Knights- who don't need 'em). S5 cavalry with a 1+6++ or a 1+ and 3A each is pretty lethal. Ignore the fact that they gouge about 250pts/regiment for 5 of them. They certainly aren't rank breakers unless you foot the bill for an Exalted on a Juggernaut to take up some space in the front rank and go with 8 knights in the regiment. But that's lunacy, and terribly pricey- leaving you with ~2 regiments like this in your list.
They make up for it of course by having Hounds, which are Warbeasts and will happily surge through terrain without worrying about sprained-ankle rolls, and the ability to toss some semblance of armor onto their light cavalry (LA&S). If you want an All-Cav army that plays the way All-Cav used to, go with Chaos.
In a not-so-close run for 3rd, you have empire. To run an effective Empire army, you have to admit that lances are terrible, and that our initiative is even worse. So just cut your losses, grab some Great Weapons, throw in a Priest for the Hatred, and some Wizards for Lore of Life, and cross your fingers. They're not bad, don't get me wrong, but as others have already said, you need the supporting elements of the book.
Empire are a much better army if you're willing to throw foot into the mix. And if we're going to do that, then you may as well throw Bretonians out of the lineup altogether.
HighElf Cavalry- These used to be my babies. Now, not so much. They have paper-thin armor and they're pricey. ASF is cool, but it just gives us Hatred, which Emps can get with a 90pt upgrade called a Priest. We need infantry, which means that we're fighting with a split base approach. This isn't bad, I wrote an entire tactica discussing how it works and how to make it work, but right now, it just won't cut it. Our chariots have never been good in a cavalry list, our Light Cav is as expensive as most people's knights and they have half the firepower of an Emp Outrider- it's just a bad day all around. We're stuck using lances on S3 guys. Our up side is that we have some awesome magic, so if you can bolster your force with that, you might pull out a win or two once in a while. But don't count on it.
Elves are a great infantry army, but their cavalry is sadly lackluster now in 8th.
Personally, I would avoid all cavalry forces. They used to rock because they could charge in, pile on attacks at high strength, cut down 1-2 ranks of the enemy, and then be free from attacks back. The enemy was left relying on static SCR, which we usually had them nearly tied on Outnumber, we almost always carried a banner of our own, and the maximum rank bonus was +3. Unless you were a dwarf, I typically had you rolling on -3LD to break from me. Now though, the enemy is stubborn with more ranks, and they will always get to attack back. Stubborn was a nightmare for Cavalry, and now everybody has it. Protracted fights were a nightmare for cavalry, and now everyone gets to fight us for what feels like 2 rounds or more. It's not a good atmosphere for cavalry anymore. They're support regiments- use them that way and you'll do fine.
I think its Warriors of Chaos.
Even our normal guys strike at I4 with knights being I5, and our heros can beat down most lords.
MoK knights with a Hero/Lord on horse are just plain savage, having high WS, S, T, A and a 1+ AS aswell as a guy in there that can remove ranks by himself.
While brettonians are good, even the lance usually breaks against knights.
Im an avid Bretonnian player and as hard as WoC's hit my Brets beat them ever time. WoC, imo and from what Ive seen, dont do well with just cav. they need rank/file troops or pit units. I frequently run all knights and each unit can pit and hammer, although I shoot for more hammers than pits. Sometimes, I run with Yeomen or Pegasus but all cav.